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View Full Version : [1500pts][Ultramarines][Competitive]



Kalibroxin
23rd April 2009, 05:27
I am finally getting back into 40k, and I want Ultramarines to be the army that I dedicate myself to. I have played them before, and Lord Macragge and his Honour Guard are itching to get back into the action. The first list that I have come up with is 1500 points exactly, and I believe that it is really solid. Here it is:

HQ

Marneus Calgar [265] - Armor of Antilochus
Honour Guard [280] - 1 Chapter Champion - 5 Honour Guard - Chapter Banner - Drop Pod

TROOPS

Tactical Squad [180] - 10 Marines - Lascannon - Flamer
Tactical Squad [180] - 10 Marines - Lascannon - Flamer
Tactical Squad [180] - 10 Marines - Lascannon - Flamer

FAST ATTACK

Scout Bike Squad [185] - 6 Bikes - Sergeant w/ Powerfist - 3 Bikes w/ Astartes Grenade Launcher

HEAVY SUPPORT

Devastator Squad [230] - 10 Marines - 4 Missile Launchers - Combat Squads (2 Missile Launchers each)

I like the idea of dropping in Marneus and his Honour Guard next to an enemy flank, and sweeping across the battlefield with them. I like the models a lot, and I have yet to use them. Please let me know what you think, as your ideas are always appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Kal

yWizePapaSmurfy
23rd April 2009, 06:04
Calgar & Honour Guards don't really sweep through anything...Especially since you cant assault after Deep Striking.

jedihobbit
23rd April 2009, 06:20
I like the idea of dropping in Marneus and his Honour Guard next to an enemy flank, and sweeping across the battlefield with them. I like the models a lot, and I have yet to use them. Please let me know what you think, as your ideas are always appreciated.

This is a bad idea. If you drop these guy's first turn they should die, if they are not dead then your extremely lucky. Dropping them itself is not a bad idea, but they will be all alone, and if you plan on assaulting 2nd turn they'll be very close to the enemy, who are usually armed with ranged weapons.

Maybe drop some stuff and give your 2 or all of your Tac squads Drop Pods too, this creates a actual threat other than Calgar&Crew. As it stands your lack of tanks (not a bad thing) means any anti-tank high Str/Ap weapons are going to be pointed at Calgar after he lands. It's just a lot of points for a small unit, and small unit your basicly serving up on a silver platter to the enemy.

As far as flanks are concerned most people have become much better at guarding them since Outflank and the new Drop Pod were introduced.

Kalibroxin
23rd April 2009, 12:23
The whole "not assaulting after deep-striking" is a given, as I know the rules quite well, but other than that I don't see a real problem with deep striking them. I am not going to just throw them at the enemy like a novice, and if there aren't any safe areas to deploy them, I will just deep strike them elsewhere. But, if my opponent has made a mistake with their deployment, I will deep strike them, utilizing as much cover as I can to prevent as many casualties as possible, and exploit it. With their 2+ saves, and the ability to automatically pass Ld checks, I think that they are even stronger at maintaining their ground, and pursuing the opponent on turn two. Plus, typically on turn two, I can use the scouts to help with their assault.

Another thing that is considered bad by most players still using the 4th Edition mentality is that a ton of points in a single unit is not a good idea. In 5th Edition I have found that it isn't a bad thing, as the points are usually spent on an extremely elite unit, that causes a lot of problems, and denies KP for my opponent.

I had tossed around the idea of dropping the Scout Bikers, Drop Pod, and the Lascannons in the Tactical Squads in favor of a Land Raider Redeemer with Multi-Melta, and throwing Marneus and Honour Guard in there. This seems like another viable option. Any thoughts?

Thank you,

Kal

yWizePapaSmurfy
23rd April 2009, 13:31
Its a ton of points in a relatively easy to kill unit, hows that for size?

Tarion'Maseth
23rd April 2009, 13:42
The whole "not assaulting after deep-striking" is a given, as I know the rules quite well, but other than that I don't see a real problem with deep striking them. I am not going to just throw them at the enemy like a novice, and if there aren't any safe areas to deploy them, I will just deep strike them elsewhere. But, if my opponent has made a mistake with their deployment, I will deep strike them, utilizing as much cover as I can to prevent as many casualties as possible, and exploit it. With their 2+ saves, and the ability to automatically pass Ld checks, I think that they are even stronger at maintaining their ground, and pursuing the opponent on turn two. Plus, typically on turn two, I can use the scouts to help with their assault.The issue is that it's quite hard to block LoS in 5th. Any vaguely mobile (I.e., Mech) army will just re-position and gun you down. It's a third of your army, and it'll get eliminated quickly in a turn. That essentially means you're playing 1000 versus 1500.

It'll work sometimes, but only against slow, unwieldy armies.

Anyway, if you like it, stick with it. Worst case scenario is that it draws fire, giving the rest of your army more time. Which leads onto my next point.

What are your Tac. squads doing? From your list, it doesn't look like your combat squadding them... Personally, I'd try to get them transports. 3 Lascannons for 540 points is not good anti-armour.

If you got them Rhinos and Meltas, they'd actually be able to hunt tanks. As it is, you're looking at taking down about 1 serious tank a turn with the list.

(Missile Launchers versus AV14 is bad odds. So your 3 Lascannons essentially have to do all the work.)

Kalibroxin
23rd April 2009, 14:06
What did you think of the Redeemer idea? This would give Marneus and Honour Guard more survivability while they make their way across the board. I also picked the Redeemer because of how awesome it is once it gets to the enemy lines, and I can think of no other vehicle that would be better suited for launching an assault like this. Those Flamestorm Cannons are amazing, and giving it a Multi-Melta would definitely help at destroying vehicles with armor 14.

And in regards to my Tactical Squads - In the 11 years of playing 40k, I have always used the Tactical Squad as a mobile unit with options. I move them around to get into fire positions, with having the Heavy Weapon as an option, not as the sole purpose of the unit. I am not sure I like the idea of combat squads for Tactical Squads, because mine are typically trying to get into positions where they will undoubtedly take casualties on the way, so I want as many bodies as I can in order to get them to where they need to be, and still be able to hold that position once they get there. It would also add 3 more KP to the list, and I want as few of these as possible. The Devastators are a bit different, because they don't move a whole lot, and I like the thought of 2 sets of 2 missile launchers pointed at my enemy's vehicles.

rohin1204
23rd April 2009, 16:15
HQ

Marneus Calgar [265] - Armor of Antilochus
Honour Guard [280] - 1 Chapter Champion - 5 Honour Guard - Chapter Banner - Drop Pod

Ok

TROOPS

Tactical Squad [180] - 10 Marines - Lascannon - Flamer
Tactical Squad [180] - 10 Marines - Lascannon - Flamer
Tactical Squad [180] - 10 Marines - Lascannon - Flamer

just lascannons and flamers? Are you expecting tanks deploying CC specialists? change some

FAST ATTACK

Scout Bike Squad [185] - 6 Bikes - Sergeant w/ Powerfist - 3 Bikes w/ Astartes Grenade Launcher

ok

HEAVY SUPPORT

Devastator Squad [230] - 10 Marines - 4 Missile Launchers - Combat Squads (2 Missile Launchers each)

Again more variety needed

Thanks in advance,

Kal

Tarion'Maseth
23rd April 2009, 16:20
And in regards to my Tactical Squads - In the 11 years of playing 40k, I have always used the Tactical Squad as a mobile unit with options. I move them around to get into fire positions, with having the Heavy Weapon as an option, not as the sole purpose of the unit. I am not sure I like the idea of combat squads for Tactical Squads, because mine are typically trying to get into positions where they will undoubtedly take casualties on the way, so I want as many bodies as I can in order to get them to where they need to be, and still be able to hold that position once they get there.Then Multi-meltas would be golden for them. They're a weapon that actually has a decent chance of destroying a tank.

It also saves you a significant number of points per squad, maybe enough to get you transports.

Now, the biggest issue I have with the Redeemer is it would be fully half your army, and would get toasted by a single good anti-armour unit, leaving them footslogging.

ads_d[-_-]b
23rd April 2009, 21:49
unless ur gonna split the tatical squads into combat sqauds no point in takin lasconnos