Infantry Guard - Starting Army

[LneWlf]

Heya! Was wondering if this list is any good for starting? If anyone has any other ideas, please feel free to comment!

HQ:

Senior Officer - Bolt pistol & Power weapon
Vox Caster
Medic
Regimental Standard
Meltaguner
-Carapace armour, krak grenades

Points: 157


Troops:

1 Platoon:

1 Platoon Command Squad:

Commander - Plasma Pistol, Power weapon
Vox Caster
Medic
Platoon Standard
Heavy Flamer
-Krak Grenades

Points: 125

Squad 1: Infanty

Seargent - Bolt Pistol, Power Weapon
9 Guardsmen
-Grenade Launcher, Vox Caster, Krak Grenades

Points - 82

Squad 2: Infantry

Seargent - Laspistol & CCW
9 Guardsmen - Grenade Launcher, Vox Caster, Krak Grenades

Points: 70

Heavy Weapons Squad Alpha:
Missile launcher x 2
Mortar
Krak Grenades

Points: 105

2 Platoon:

Platoon Command Squad:

Commander - Power Fist, Laspistol
Vox Caster
Medic
Platoon Standard
Sniper
Krak Grenades

Points: 105

Squad 1: Infantry
Seargent - Laspistol & CCW
9 Guardsmen - Vox Caster, Flamer, Krak Grenades

Points: 70

Squad 2: Infantry
Seargent - Bolt Pistol, Power Weapon
9 Guardsmen - Vox Caster, Flamer, Krak Grenades

Points: 82

Heavy Weapons Squad Bravo:
Lascannon x2
Autocannon
Krak Grenades

Points: 85

Fast Attack:

Armoured Sentinel Squadron: x2
Sentinel 1:
-Lascannon, Hunter-Killer Missile
Sentinel 2:
-Plasma Cannon, Searchlight, Hunter-Killer Missile

Points: 166

Total Points: 770




Thanks,

LneWlf

[Straker]

No offense, but who the hell plays a 770 pt game? Why not make it 843 pts then?

Drop it down to 750 (a common, even number), please.

Also, your ability to counter heavy armor feels lacking for that kind of points. I can comfortably fit 1 Leman Russ into a 500pt game, let alone what someone can do with 250 more points.....or 270 in your case :P

[Baragash]

No offense, but who the hell plays a 770 pt game? Why not make it 843 pts then?

Looks offensive to me. Try and be more friendly when pointing out strange army totals, particularly to a beginner.

[Straker]

No offense, but who the hell plays a 770 pt game? Why not make it 843 pts then?

Looks offensive to me. Try and be more friendly when pointing out strange army totals, particularly to a beginner.

Sorry man, the internet doesn't always convey the tone you see in your head. :(

Any thoughts on how to help the guy out?

[bartoszmp]

Well start with your HQ. Just because all that came in the HQ box set doesnt mean you HAVE to use.

I find that adding too many upgrades just kind of overwhelms you with special rules that you WILL forget to take advantage of in game. Thus taking up points for say another gun. You NEVER forget to fire ALL your weapons. ;)
Take out the standard and medic, put in an Autocannon team.

[LneWlf]

:) hmmm alrighty!!! So the medic and standard are fairly useless then? Or just not as usefull as an autocannon team?

[bartoszmp]

Like I said I dont understand 100% how they work, so I rather tear thru things with an autocannon. But thats just me.

If you feel you fully understand how to use certain units and special weapons, more power to you.

Just in past experiences, I never used their benefits O.o

[×ÏVÏøøÐz×]

I understand your a beginner, so it's likely your not fully aware of how everything works, so I'll take that into consideration (mind you, I've only played four 5th edition games, I'm still use to 4th edition, eugh, that aside) I'll try and help. :)

Firstly. Krak Grenades, you don't need them. You just, dont. Their used in close combat (unless it changed?), and are only useful if you assault light to medium vehicles. Your not going to do that very often, nor do you need to (you get big guns to kill vehicles, not the men who fire them....Er... You get what I mean) :lol: . You can add in another infantry squad with an autocannon or heavy bolter if you drop them all, which is alot more worthwhile than giving units who are meant to fight at range a S6 vehicle killing grenade. Especially on the heavy weapons team, they really dont need them. Hell, they dont even need the frag grenades they come with, but krak grenades are useless on them. Their meant to utilize heavy weaponry, thus, ranged weaponry. Often their meant to kill vehicles with missile launchers or autocannons, so why would you want them to assualt a vehicle when they have S9 and S8 weaponry? :? As I said, unless krak grenades have changed with the new edition and do something useful, their um, not really needed on Imperial Guardsmen.

If you want your command squads to survive, keep the medics, but their not essential. Yes, they give a T3 5+ save unit feel no pain, but, their almost as expensive as a bare infantry squad, you can save lotta points by dropping them, but as I said, they can help your command squad survive. If you want to keep something, keep the Standard. Allowing units within 12" to re-roll failed Morale and Pinning tests is great, as it'll mean you can avoid your units running at key times and from being pinned. Sure you can not have it and use 'Get Back in the Fight' order, but thats using an order that could otherwise be used as 'First Rank FIRE! Second rank, FIRE!' or 'Bring it down!' or something else. I dunno, the Standard is great IMO. Medics are hit or miss, your still T3, so, meh. Vox-Casters are also great (key IMO), kudos on including them.

About the Troop choices. I've found, and been told, that including only one or two of each weapon in an IG list doesn't work. You can't rely on BS3 to do much in the hitting department, so it's key to include multiples of each weapon. I only see this issue with your heavy weapon squads. Missile Launchers are both anti-tank and anti-infantry, mortars are, eh, anti-infantry. If you decide to shoot a tank with that squad, the mortar will be wasted, sure it's free, but uhm, it's a wasted shot. I'd give the squd all missile launchers, or if you want anti-infantry, all mortars. The other heavy squad is alright, but again, I'd give it all lascannons or all autocannons for consistency and reliabilitys sake.
Platoon standards arent really useful unless you really, really need that extra point, otherwise the points could be used for better things (like heavy weapons in infantry squads, which is always good, infantry squads perform alot better I've found when you give them heavy weapons. Squads with power weapons and flamers are good tarpit units, but honestly, IG aren't meant for CC, they can do well with numbers, but T3, 5+ save aren't good stats for CC.
In the command squads, one sniper, isn't going to do much, you need numbers on them, so at least three I've found. He especialy seems out of place when the rest of the squad is meant for CC, with a powerfist, a standard? I'd drop it and replace it with a flamer. Same as the heavy flamer. Your paying 4x the points of a normal flamer for +1 S and -1 AP, nuh uh. I don't care how awesome they are, that many points nets you two flamers in each platoon squad, which makes a hell of alot bigger mess than a single heavy flamer.

So, hopefully that was somewhat helpful. Sorry for the slight wall of text. :) *Runs off hoping he helped a bit*

[LneWlf]

OMG!! Thanks man! that actually helped a lot! I dropped the krak's...altough as i may have stated before the platoons were already made...:) i kinda got ummm...how do i say it? Impatient? So unforutunatly they have to stay that way for the moment, but in the future i'll take this advice! It actually helped a lot!!! And the reason I did the two & one on the HWS, was that I was hoping for a mix effect - able to really pound vehicles, and also about to do damage to infantry. I never know where anything is gonna be on the field, so I want the ability to do damage no matter the location of the models. Maybe it was a bad idea?


Thanks,

LneWlf

[Col.Aldo_Miles]

i personally just think it's a waste of a either a mortar or two missile launchers, because the whole appeal of a mortar is that u don't have to see the target, whereas with the missile launchers LOS is required so your either hiding 2 weapons, or playing one in a roll that it's not meant for.

[LneWlf]

ohhh okay! That makes sense I guess :) thanks!

[×ÏVÏøøÐz×]

A query. What are your plans for those armoured Sentinels?

I would make a suggestion, but it did take me a few tweaks to get the tactic right, but if you want, here;

Scout Sentinels are alot better IMO for their points over armoured Sentinels. Yes, you lose AV12, and some scary weaponry, but, an armoured Sentinel cannot pop up behind vehicles and shoot rear armour. Scout Sentinels can outflank, thus, take squads of three, all multilasers, and they cost 105 points for three. Most rear armour is ten. 9 S6 shots should be sufficient to blow it apart. If anything though, the outflanking really helps to distract your opponent. He's moving towards you, say, in a mech list. You outflank six or so Sentinels on THEIR board edge, it becomes a 'ZOMGwtf do I do!?' moment. They can either target your normal infantry/tanks, or choose to destroy the Sentinels which could potentially destory vehicles due to facing their vulnerable rear armour, and which can contest objectives if he's holding any. Even against infantry, 9 S6 shots, while not very spectacualr, can put a dent in most squads of lightly armoured infantry.

Just something to think about, if it makes sense. I'm still usnure of it, but you never know. You can get three Sentinels, that outflank and move through cover, for 105 points, and that way you save some points for, well, look at that, another infantry squad!
Also, in general, are you planning for an all infantry list? And what type of list do you want? Static gunline? Mechanized?

I dunno, eh, I just like to help. :)

[LneWlf]

:) very helpful indeed! As for the sentinels - i'm looking for heavy support in a smaller way. I'm looking to take a no-tank/limited tank army, so I need something that can cause damage. Armoured Sentinels just seemed to fit the bill.

LneWlf

[LneWlf]

So after some tweeks and twitches...and noticing i messed up the numbers the first time around, i've created a new list (which will hopefully be used in a 1000-odd point game in the near future - still looking for some more points to be used...i think);

189th 'Cadia's Meatshield' Infantry:

HQ:

Company Command: 50 pts.
-Officer: - Plasma Pistol - 10 pts.
- Power Weapon - 10 pts.
-Vox Caster: 5 pts
-Regimental Standard: 15 pts
-Medic: 30 pts.
-Plasma Gun: 15 pts
-Carapace Armour: 20 pts.

Points: 155

Troops:

Alpha Platoon:

Alpha Command: 30pts
-Officer: -Power Fist: 15 pts.
-Medic: 30 pts.
-Platoon Standard: 15 pts.
-Vox Caster: 5 pts.
-Sniper: 5 pts.

Points: 100

Alpha-1 Squad: 50 pts
-Seargent: -Bolt Pistol: 2 pts.
-Power weapon: 10 pts.
-Vox Caster: 5 pts
-Grenade Launcher: 5 pts.

Points: 72

Alpha-2 Squad: 50 pts
-Vox Caster: 5 pts.
-Grenade Launcher: 5 pts.

Points: 60

Heavy Weapons Squad 'Demolisher': 60 pts
-Missile Launcher x2: 20 pts.
-Mortar

Points: 80

Bravo Platoon:

Bravo Command: 30 Pts.
-Officer: -Plasma Pistol: 10 pts.
-Medic: 30 pts.
-Platoon Standard: 15 pts.
-Vox Caster: 5 pts.
-Heavy Flamer: 20 pts.

Points: 105

Bravo-1 Squad: 50 Pts.
-Seargent: -Bolt Pistol: 2 pts.
-Power weapon: 10 pts.
-Vox Caster: 5 pts
-Flamer: 5 pts.

Points: 72

Bravo-2 Squad: 50 pts.
-Vox Caster: 5 pts.
-Flamer: 5 pts.

Points: 60

Heavy Weapons Squad 'Crackshot': 60 pts.
-Lascannon x 2: 30 pts.
-Autocannon: 5 pts.

Points: 95 pts.

Fast Attack:

Armoured Sentinel Squadron 'Death Walkers': 110 pts

Sentinel 'Dark Angel' :
-Lascannon: 15 pts.
-Hunter-Killer Missile: 10 pts.

Points: 80

Sentinel 'Satan's Child':
-Plasma Cannon: 20 pts.
-Hunter-Killer Missile: 10 pts.
-Searchlight: 1 pt.

Points: 86

--Points: 166 (x2 sentinels)

Total Points: 965

*Note: So this is the revised list I had come up with...so i'm just wondering if anyone has any suggestions, etc etc. With regards to the Command Squads - The platoon command squads are going to be going into the brute of the fight, so I want a mix of CC & long-ish range from them (the sniper), while the Company Command, will be hanging back a bit to provide more of a supportive role. The medics are to keep them alive as long as possible, as this is going to be a Infantry only army (as much as possible). In regards to the HWS I wanted a mix so that each squad may take on either vehicles or infantry semi-effectively. With the mortar, I get the blast, even though it defeats its normal purpose (no-LOS i've been told??). Lastly the Sentinels - against the judgement given, I went against scouts, as I don't care to drop in behind enemy lines (i'll have Kasrkin later on to do that), I want a front-force, and I needed units to be tank-killers. These seemed the logical choice, seeing as I wont have any tanks in this army.

--Also i'm looking for cool names for the Platoons, Command and whoever else doesn't have a name, so any ideas???

Thanks again,

LneWlf

[LneWlf]

so either it really reallly sucks and no one can find a way to fix it....or i've actually created a list that may work?

LneWlf

[memcwho]

i think it may just be the funny total again :\

[LneWlf]

:( i know but i'm trying! nothing i seem to do will bring the total to a normal number. So what i'm trying to do is make a 1000-odd point army...TRYING to at least...any ideas?

[Midnight Cowboy]

This list is a start, and there's some good ideas at work here. But there's also some room for improvement. Here's some little things you might want to consider, and feel free to take or leave these suggestions. I'm just trying to help another IG player here!

The Power Weapons are okay, but you're still Guard and Close Combat isn't going to be a good spot for you. Medics or not, those 5 guys in your Command Squads are not going to survive long by hoping to run across the board to engage the enemy. The sniper rifles are also Heavy 1, so you can't shoot those if you move. In other words, that guy is dead weight if he's moving. As for the Medics, three of them is costing you 90 points. You can have another Sentinel for that, almost another two Infantry Squads, or a Penal Legion squad. You'll do better with overwhelming firepower than rerolling a couple unsaved wounds. Or think about it this way, do you really want to charge some Chaos Marines with 5+ armor saves?

Your Command Squads are better off giving the orders to make the Infantry Squads perform better, not lead by example like some half-witted action star. And if you bury your Command Squads behind your Infantry lines, the regimental standard works much better. You'll also be limiting yourself to only two orders from the CCS if you send out your PCSes. Your commanders have their abilities you paid points for, so you might as well use them!

Speaking of flags, the platoon standards don't help out your troops' morale, it just makes the command squad a little better in close combat. But probably not enough to make a difference. I'd rather bark out the "FRFSRF!!" to a combined squad for either 20 or 30 lasgun shots. I like those numbers much better than 6-7 CC attacks (or 11-12 on the charge). And if your squad has more synergy (say, three to four flamers or grenade launchers), they'll be much more effective. One special weapon is a bit of a waste in a Command squad.

If you're planning on doing some CC with IG, use the weight of your infantry platoons to carry you towards victory! The have more wounds, more bodies and more attacks than a PCS. That one little power weapon isn't going to win the war, and is more of a point sink. Use the Penal Legion or Vets, as they can do a little more damage. And then think about sticking a Priest and/or (Lord) Commissar in a squad for grins. And since your Inf Squads lack Heavy Weapons, they're practically begging to charge the enemy anyway.

For your Heavy Weapon squads, just make them all the same. With the points you can save by dropping the platoon standards, you have more than enough to afford another ML and Lascannon. If the weapon is good enough to take two of, you might as well take three of them. And you've already committed yourself to that squad's purpose with two of those weapons. Anything that you need to fire two Lascannons at isn't going to need an Autocannon shooting it too. But three Twin-linked Lascannons under the "Bring It Down" order is essentially a static Vendetta. If you want a versatile squad, use your Missle Launcher team for that job. They can lob Frag or Krak missles, so fire three of those and put the mortar in an Infantry Squad instead.