Wraiths vs Lychguard

[PyroSikTh]

Here's something interesting I've been pondering on recently. In my lists, this is usually something I have trouble deciding on; Canoptek Wraiths or Lychguard?

Recently I've been swaying towards the Wraiths. The annoying thing I find with Lychguard is they can't have Warscythes and a Shield. They can't pop tanks and survive the heavier guns they're guaranteed to get aimed in their direction. Wraiths have their cake and eat it too. With S6, Rending and 3+ Invulnerable, they threaten heavy infantry, tanks, and can survive enemy heavy weaponry reasonably well. They don't have to choose. It gets even better when you see they have an extra wound, are Jump Infantry that ignore terrain almost completely and get all this for 5pts/model less. Even better, they have the "option" (not really an option is it ;)) to reduce the enemy to I1, so will always strike first.

Of course, on the flipside, they're not T5 so they're more susceptible to small arms fire, and they don't get Reanimation Protocols, so once they're dead, they're dead.

Which way do the rest of you lean? Would you rather have Lychguard or Wraiths?

[edmundblack]

The ones that'll die quickest. Just sayin' ... 8-[ :P

Sensible hat ... on.

Erm ... good one. Bit of both if possible and practical perhaps? Also depends one what the rest of the army is doing or lacking. Leaning more towards Wraiths for their superior harrassing and mobility.

[bigfishboy]

I have had good luck with wraiths (with whip coils of course :P) They can stand in combat against most things with their saves and also the amount of attacks they can chuck out!

Lychguard I still unsure on, they attack after most other units meaning they could already be down on numbers, but they are T5 but that is the main thing with them!

At moment wraiths all the way for me, and Lychguard I going to do more play testing with!

[Dragonknights]

I knew this would be coming soon. There is a reason why I actually prefer Lychguard over Wraiths. But that has actually to do because of another unit. You see Wraiths use fast attack slot options. Which I rather prefer to max out with scarabs. So that's the main reason I would go for Lychguard rather then Wraiths.

[Aeviaan]

I knew this would be coming soon. There is a reason why I actually prefer Lychguard over Wraiths. But that has actually to do because of another unit. You see Wraiths use fast attack slot options. Which I rather prefer to max out with scarabs. So that's the main reason I would go for Lychguard rather then Wraiths.

You take 30 scarabs???? O.o

[Dragonknights]

You take 30 scarabs???? O.o

*lol* My last 3 opponents looked the sameway as you do now. :p

And one of them even said the same line. XD

[edmundblack]

And your opponent has fun ... when?

[Aeviaan]

I'm still of the impression that Scarabs are an augment unit, not a core. More then 2 units in unnecessary, unless they are only 4-5 swarms each. I only have 2 units of 5 in my 1850, and they may get replaced with a unit of Tomb Blades.

[Fingers]

If you want cool looking models, and are playing for fun, Lychguard. If you want to win, Wraiths. I cant think of a single reason to take LG over Wraiths currently for cc unit. I guess pw attacks on all yours guys...assuming they live to use them.

Wraiths:
Ignore cover
3++ save
lash coils
ability to take str 6 pistol
higher move
two wounds
higher strength
much better chance at breaking into vehicles
more attacks

LG:
Better toughness
chance to reflect melta/plasma shots
cooler looking
power weapons
reanimation protocol
able to have cryptek/lord attached

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

Good reason to take Lychs over Wraiths? Force Org restrictions.

[Dragonknights]

And your opponent has fun ... when?

I don't show mercy to people whom don't come up with their own lists but instead choice to look up on the internet and make the most broken list there is. Funny thing though even though it were 3 different opponents. They all played the same space wolf list. And with the scarab hive (A nickname I have given to a particilair 1700 points list with 30 scarabs) they all 3 have bitten the dust. Their once to broken lists have become 2nd or maybe even 3rd tier. I normaly play for fun, but when I face such guys to who play to win and not for fun. Well I just can't help it but to crush those broken no fun lists. One of them is now even switching over to Necrons believing it is the next top tier army. The fool because the list I made has some weaknesses but because he never makes his own lists he fails to see it. Yeah people who play like that really grind my gears.


I'm still of the impression that Scarabs are an augment unit, not a core. More then 2 units in unnecessary, unless they are only 4-5 swarms each. I only have 2 units of 5 in my 1850, and they may get replaced with a unit of Tomb Blades.

Well the thing is I have made a list with 30 Scarabs just to piss off 3 power players at my local club whom all 3 play the same broken space wolf list which they just looked up on the internet. The list is really hard, but it has certain weaknesses and I doubt against certain armies such as Nids it really isn't going to work well. I'm a veteran player also a winner a grandtournament of my country. I always build my armies around theme and fluff. There was this story in book fall of damnos that really caught my eye of how Imperial Guards were eaten up by swarm and later their comrads saw the bones of those guards droving up and poking out the swarm of metal bugs.

Since I can wield 100,000 points of necrons (Old Dex) I have more then enough swarms to make it. I also have 9 spyders added in the list. The rest is filled with a cryptek of transmorgification, Necron Overlord and troops. But the swarms are what the list is about. I even have began planning costumizing some new swarms with bones of their victems laying around their base.

[edmundblack]

Net-listers be damned indeed. But what about a non-standard "all comers" list. 30 Scarabs aren't going to get shifted in one turn. Fight fire with fire works to a certain degree, but if someone hasn't bought any fire, opting for a slight warming, what're they going to do? Space Wolves aren't "broken", just abused, same for Grey Knights.

[Angelofblades]

I had someone try to pull 20+ scarabs on me in a game. Taught them a lesson never to do that again. It's called a Furioso with talons. Started out at 4 attacks, all of which hit and wounded, that netted me 12 more, those 12, that netted me like 25 more etc. then there were no more scarabs! haha, loved the look on my opponent's face.

[Cryage]

Very tough call, both have proven their worth to me, only issue I find with lychguard is how bloody slow they are. Even running u are only getting about 9" each turn. Lychguard seem to be excellent for escorting the mass group of warriors and wraiths and destroyer lord are awesome at chasing vehicles and assinating weaker squads quickly

[The Imperial Fist]

LychGuard, all day, all long.

The fact that they can be linked to a Lord/Overlord (or both) and a Cryptek, and they all come back.

I have seen how sturdy this unit is against the best in the business and I have no complaints, they do work.

But, i wouldn't rule out using wraiths, they are great, I would use them for more hit and run and strike missions, then brute force power house to power house combat.

[Sukth]

I don't show mercy to people whom don't come up with their own lists but instead choice to look up on the internet and make the most broken list there is. Funny thing though even though it were 3 different opponents. They all played the same space wolf list. And with the scarab hive (A nickname I have given to a particilair 1700 points list with 30 scarabs) they all 3 have bitten the dust. Their once to broken lists have become 2nd or maybe even 3rd tier. I normaly play for fun, but when I face such guys to who play to win and not for fun. Well I just can't help it but to crush those broken no fun lists. One of them is now even switching over to Necrons believing it is the next top tier army. The fool because the list I made has some weaknesses but because he never makes his own lists he fails to see it. Yeah people who play like that really grind my gears.

I couldn't agree more. So many of the kids that play fantasy with me (I must call them kids I'm 16 there like 14 xD) and even 40k have to be the power players because when they don't win they get all pissy. I remember two such occasions where I wanted to just hurt people. One was when the manager said there was going to be a simple 500pt campaign going on for 40k. I thought it would be cool to look around and see what there is. I was probably 14 at the time. 500pt nid army sitting there with a Swarmlord and just a screen of gaunts marching ahead. Really? Dude its 500pts and your 12...stop being power hungry.
Second was a few weeks after whenever the BA codex came out. This kid took a list for them off of the internet and needed models so he could finish it out. Hes probably 13 or so maybe older. His mom came in to get him because he lived too far to walk, and he said "mom I need this." His mom stared and said no. I am not joking you when I say he literally dropped to the ground, rolled, screamed, and cried because she said that. Kept screaming "I NEED THIS TO WIN MOM I NEED THIS TO WIN!" His mom gave up and bought the models for him. 200+ dollars worth. Next week he is in smiling with his brand new army. Vetran player kicked his butt in three turns. I. Never. Stopped. Laughing.