The Incursion of Plexious VII - Mafia victory.

[Pox]

ok 48 hours for the first day.

The Peace of Plexious VII is shattered forever by the screams of the tormented and dying, whole families are found butchered and defiled. Only a handful of guardsmen and civilians seem to have survived the onslaught so far but those responsible seem far removed from justice.

over to you lot - if you have not received your role PM then let me know (or don't understand it.)

To vote for someone just put VOTE: NAME at the top of your post, preferably in bold so it is easy for me to notice and no-one gets lynched by mistake.

player listo:

1 - MalktThe2nd
2 - Baragash - innocent civilian lover (pro-town)
3 - Strassa - vox operator (messenger/Pro-town)
4 - PyroSikth/Drakon again.
5 - Papasmurf - commissar (pro-town/double voter)
6 - Loner
7 - Drakon - lynched Day 1 (Sane Cop/pro-town)
8 - Beeva
9 - Stalker - innocent civilian lover (pro-town)
10 - Kilroy
11 - Xarboth
12 - Doohickey
13 - Shadowsplicer - callidus assassin

[Stalker21]

*Makes moon eyes at Bara*

So, yeah, are we vilifying someone already? Or waiting for night?

[Pox]

The first day phase is always a bit weird, as no-one "important" has been killed yet and you have little info. You can lynch someone on the first day, and chat amongst yourselves in this thread about anything game important if you want (such as roles, amount of mafia you think their is etc.) most of it is blind guessing. If you get lucky you might well lynch a mafia player and thus the town will be in the lead, or the mafia might well lead the conversation and a town player will die. All the info from today (like who voted for whom, etc.) might be useful for the next couple of days since obviously mafia players obviously wouldn't mind killing someone on day 1 but would not want another mafia player dead.

In essence day one is where you have the least info, but are still able to lynch someone if you desire. The person with the most votes at the end of the 48hr period is lynched. (or as soon as a majority vote is reached - which is 7 votes.)

[DrakonTheNightLord]

Vote: Kilroy

As if you didn't see this coming..

[Baragash]

Vote: Pox

Failure to transfer the player list into this topic is clearly designed to aid the Mafia :P

[PyroSikTh]

So we don't have to vote on Day 1?

-ERROR ERROR-

[Doohicky]

We could always vote for abstain.

I am watching you all. Especially YOU!

As always in these games I will be targetting whoever is lurking.

[ShadowSplicer57]

Vote: Stalker21

First one to respond.

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

Does anyone want to take the gamble and vote today? We shall see. What's the usual distribution of Roles in a game like this? (Like how many Mafia can we expect?)

[Doohicky]

12 in the game.

That means there are likely to be up to 3 Mafia, maybe only 2.

BUT, this could be a game where people can be turned in which case a maximum of 2.

Then we have the option of 2 Mafia groups as well as the town.
these are only some of the options though.

But at the end of the day we really don't know.

[Baragash]

IIRC from the discussion topic* Pox gave everyone a power which suggests 3 or 2x2 rather than 2.

*Watching 90210 cba to check :P

[Beeva]

We could always vote for abstain.


Yeah, I vote for him too! Lynch him!! LYNCH HIM!!!!

[Doohicky]

Abstain is almost as bad as that Kilroy fella. Haha

[Xarboth]

Vote: Baragash


*Watching 90210 cba to check
'nuff said.

[ShadowSplicer57]

Abstain is almost as bad as that Kilroy fella. Haha
Various levels of not-get.

[Pox]

The player listo is up, and you have 24hrs left (approx) to finalise who is getting lynched if anyone:

votes so far:
Kilroy - 1 vote
Stalker21 - 1 vote
Baragash - 1 vote

after the next 24hrs if it is still a draw then the next vote placed after the time limit finalises it.

[Doohicky]

Various levels of not-get.

It was a running gag when these were run before that everyone would vote for kilroy.

[Stalker21]

I am wounded, Splicer. Though, to be honest, I am usually killed off early in these games. And I'm always an innocent.

[ShadowSplicer57]

Eh, I usually vote for the first to post on the first day of a Mafia game.

It was a running gag when these were run before that everyone would vote for kilroy.
Oh I knew that. I just didn't understand the abstain part, but now I do. At first I thought it was a person and then I was like "Oh they mean it as in the word."

[DrakonTheNightLord]

Unvote: Kilroy

Vote: Baragash

INHUMAN BEAST!

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

To avoid confusion:

THERE MUST BE ONLY 1 NYAN CAT IN THIS THREAD!

Vote: Drakon

[MalkThe2nd]

Vote: Doohicky

Going the anti-lurker so soon? :P

[Pox]

votes so far:
Baragash - 2 vote
Drakon - 1 vote
Stalker21 - 1 vote
Doohickey - 1 vote

[DrakonTheNightLord]

Unvote: Baragash
Vote: yWizePapaSmurfy

NO U

[Xarboth]

Unvote: Baragash

'twas a joke vote.

[PyroSikTh]

Unvote: Baragash

'twas a joke vote.

I'm not. He's watching 90210. When is that ever a laughing matter?

[Doohicky]

vote kilroy

Unless I am mistaken he has not posted.

[Beeva]

*rolls D12*

Vote: Bee...

oh, wait! *rolls again*

Vote: MalkThe2nd

:D

[Pox]

Baragash - 1 vote
Drakon - 1 vote
Stalker21 - 1 vote
Doohickey - 1 vote
papasmurf - 1 vote
Kilroy - 1 vote
Malk the second - 1 vote


looks like it is a draw on Day one with the time run out, so the next person on that list who gets another vote will be lynched unless you all suddenly decide to retract your votes and abstain. (everyone now suddenly eyes each other up suspicially) further days will last as long as it takes to reach a majority vote (But really there is no info on day 1)

Just to clarify as been asked by a good couple of people, YES you can pm chat to each other both during the day and night phases.

[Loner]

I am wounded, Splicer. Though, to be honest, I am usually killed off early in these games. And I'm always an innocent.

This is quite supicious to say...

[Strassa]

so now its night time dun dun dun!!

[PyroSikTh]

so now its night time dun dun dun!!

I think it's still day until someone gets a second vote...

[Beeva]

So if nobody posts... we all live...

<.<

>.>

[Stalker21]

Yep, but I have a sinking feeling. Oh, that's just these concrete shoes...

[Xarboth]

This must be the longest any tie has lasted in any game of mafia I've ever played. Do we just wait until someone gets a final vote? Or is there a time limit on it, and no lynching? I keep trying to read through to see who's giving dodgy reasons for their votes, but then remembering it's just the first day phase and they're all pretty much joke votes that aren't withdrawn.

[Doohicky]

This must be the longest any tie has lasted in any game of mafia I've ever played. Do we just wait until someone gets a final vote? Or is there a time limit on it, and no lynching? I keep trying to read through to see who's giving dodgy reasons for their votes, but then remembering it's just the first day phase and they're all pretty much joke votes that aren't withdrawn.

See I don't like people sticking to joke votes.
Yes, do it to start discussion, but to actually vote someone off have at least some sort of reason.

[Stalker21]

Well, Pox said this first Day phase was only 48 hrs and the first 24 are already gone. Unless someone else gets another vote, no one dies. Lynching isn't required today, after all.

[Pox]

Well, Pox said this first Day phase was only 48 hrs and the first 24 are already gone. Unless someone else gets another vote, no one dies. Lynching isn't required today, after all.

All 48hrs are gone, but it is a draw all round, so need someone to either change their vote and make a new one, or someone who has not voted yet to place a vote and drop the stalemate OR 2 people to abstain putting that in the majority and no lynching will happen today. But people will have to either man-up and make the killing vote or bottle out and abstain for this day to end. IF it does not reach a consensus in the next 24hrs then I will assume abstain.

[Stalker21]

VOTE: Abstain

[MalkThe2nd]

Meh I kinda like where my vote is. Voting Kilroy on grounds of lurking is kinda... too obvious. But, I'm never afraid to be the condemning vote.

Unvote: Kilroy

I feel like Abstain is not an option here. Lynching is the primary way we'll kill Mafia, and generates conversation.

Sorry bro but...

Vote: Stalker21

If you are indeed a "bad guy", you'd want to Abstain to keep us in the dark.

[MalkThe2nd]

Rather...Unvote: Doohicky

Gotta make sure to preview my posts...

[Pox]

Seems Pox was not paying attention and just as Malc shouts out his suspicions over Stalker he turns around to find DRAKON already hanging from a bulkhead!

Unfortunatly though DRAKON was a veteran officer in charge of rooting out the chaos cultists. (Sane cop - who could investigate people in the night phase to see if they where mafia or not.)

It is now the night phase, this will last 48hrs and everyone will need to PM me their night actions (if they have one/want to do it.) You cannot post in this thread during the night but feel free to PM/IRC chat all you want.

[DrakonTheNightLord]

*Shakes a spectral fist at every scumbag player*

[Kilroy]

VOTE: KILROY

Oh wait.

[Pox]

Another Dawn comes, and the world is tranquil and beautiful....

or it would be if a corpse was not nailed to the ceiling it's blood pooling across the floor and splashed over the walls. That kind of thing is bound to put a hiccup in any day.

Some of you think it is a very impressive suicide, even the way they slit their throat even AFTER nailing their hands to the ceiling, though some of you think it is foul play - a murder most extreme!

Baragash was an innocent civilian lover

So will the culprits be found or will another innocent be picked off? (anyone who had night actions expect PM's in the next 5 minutes)

[Doohicky]

Since we all have a role in this game hopefully someone got something good last night.
I would suggest only revealing your role if you are sure doing so will lead to the lynching of Mafia.
We don't want to give the Mafia an easy target.

[PyroSikTh]

So basically you want all the Mafia to tell us their role? I like this idea. Makes the game much easier.

[Xarboth]

Hmm. I'm right in thinking the lynch should have been on Stalker21, aren't I? So either Stalker21 has a defensive ability that lynched Drakon instead of him,or someone else has a day kill ability that they used before Malk changed his vote.

Now, if it was Stalker, the most common defensive ability is to kill off the person to cast the final vote, isn't it? Which should have been Malk.

So the two options are a vigilante/mafia with day kill ability; or the fact that Stalker can nominate who gets lynched instead of him, either each time he'd be lynched or a one-off ability for the first time.

Is my logic right? Is there anything else we know? We've certainly lost a fairly important role in Drakon though.

[Kilroy]

Well Xarboth, you and Malk are pretty quick to jump on the back of Stalker for abstaining. If I recall (It has been some time) he hasn't played many of these games so I don't think he is using faulty logic. So for the time being I shall Vote: Xarboth

[ShadowSplicer57]

Well Xarboth, you and Malk are pretty quick to jump on the back of Stalker for abstaining. If I recall (It has been some time) he hasn't played many of these games so I don't think he is using faulty logic. So for the time being I shall Vote: Xarboth
I don't know, I don't think it was mere circumstance that he was able to dodge a lynch like that. It had to have been a Mafia power if it instead ended up lynching a Townie, and why would they use it to save a random Townie so early in the game from being lynched just to lynch another? It just doesn't add up. Granted, I'll wait for him to get the chance to explain himself before I place my vote anywhere, but call me skeptical.

[Xarboth]

Actually, Kilroy, I think you'll find if you read back that I didn't post at all between Stalker abstaining and the lynching occurring. And I also don't think I've ever said anything against stalker at all. So I don't know where that came from? I wasn't even saying that Stalker avoiding the lynch made him suspicious - I was just stating what we knew for certain and checking with people whether I'd missed something.

Why so quick to jump on me and defend Stalker (from someone who's not even said anything negative against him at all)?

[Kilroy]

I know you didn't say anything earlier but it feels like a predatory decision to target Stalker, who has already been scrutinized by Malk, and at this point would constitute a lead culprit. Anyways I'm inclined to change my vote, I'm just trying to stimulate discusion.

[Loner]

I still think that Stalker is suspicious...
We had him nominated for a vote, yet someone else went down.

[Xarboth]

But I've never said I'm suspicious of Stalker at all. All I said was that he was the one who should have been lynched according to the vote, and that Drakon died instead. And I'm trying to work out what we can learn from that - the most likely thing is that Stalker has an ability which protects him from his first lynching. Since Pox has stated clearly that everyone has a big role, that doesn't necessarily make Stalker a suspect at all. The next likely option is that someone has a vigilante/day kill ability and PM'd Pox before Malk changed his vote, and therefore that action took precedent. Although thinking about it now, a vigilante kill wouldn't necessarily end the day without a lynch.

All I was doing was - like you - creating discussion centred around the only facts we actually know: Malk cast the final vote on Stalker, but Drakon died instead.

[Doohicky]

Actually, kit's more likely that ywisepapasmurfy has a double vote power.

Pox stated he wasn't paying attention which makes me think that the vote on drakon counted double.
since ywpsy had voted for him then double voting seems likely.
Think it is normally a town mayor role does that.

[Beeva]

Does that have to be a townsfolk power?

[Xarboth]

If it's a mafia power, and they get a nightkill as well, which they clearly do with Baragash dying, then it'd be a pretty overpowered mafia, to be honest. Although if everyone has a power role as Pox has stated, then I guess it's not out of the question. Very doubtful though, I would think.

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

I will take full responsibility for Drakon's death, though I claim that I don't have a double vote power. Seeing as I killed a useful pro-town role I put myself up for shame and if you guys want to lynch me, I don't blame you. Sorry Drakon, really was a joke vote.

All I can think of maybe Pox doing something like the Sorcerer's powers again like his old Mafia game and having a manipulative powers for the head of the Mafia. It'd be smart of the Mafia to count double votes the first round for/against a player in my eyes since no one will be willing to settle on a person or we could've tried to agree to all ABSTAIN? Either way, keeping this short I re-enforce: I take full blame for Drakon's death because I can't figure out any other ways to go about it.

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

Either way, if the Mafia still thinks I am a double-vote power, why would they not kill me?

[Kilroy]

I'm getting the feeling the smurf is a jester.

Anyways, switching votes. Unvote: Xarboth
Vote: Malk

Why else would he be so keen on lynching someone with the goal of keeping everyone alive during the day?

[Stalker21]

For the record, not that any of you have any reason to believe me, I had nothing to do with Drakon's death in any way, shape, or form. I am an innocent in this game thus far, though nobody has any reason to believe me. Drakon was lynched because he had two votes against him already when the time limit ran out. Re-read the thread and stop laying about random suspicion.

Speaking of suspicion, my own falls upon ShadowSplicer and Xarboth. They both seem to be overly bloodthirsty, wanting to kill anyone before we even have proper time to develop founded suspicions. Honestly, for myself, I think I have the most reason to vote for Splicer, both for my own sake and for the reason stated above.

Vote: ShadowSplicer

[ShadowSplicer57]

For the record, not that any of you have any reason to believe me, I had nothing to do with Drakon's death in any way, shape, or form. I am an innocent in this game thus far, though nobody has any reason to believe me. Drakon was lynched because he had two votes against him already when the time limit ran out. Re-read the thread and stop laying about random suspicion.
If you were to re-read the thread, you'd find that Drakon clearly had only one vote as the time limit ran out. Why would you even make that claim when most of the posts here acknowledge that it had to be either a mafia power or a double voter? I highly doubt that all of them failed to read the thread. Sorry but I have to look at the evidence here: You dodge a Day One lynch, why would someone go out of their way to save the Day One lynchee? It's just not the normal order of things. A Day One lynch is a gamble, you literally don't know anything, so why would someone use such a strong power so early and with such little evidence? Smurfy's claim, if it is to be true, would mean that it had to be a Mafia power that spared you and killed Drakon. Why else would anyone use a power to save the first day lynchee other than that person being a part of the Mafia? I know I was on you from the start, but I have to look at the evidence here and go place my vote on you.

Vote: Stalker21

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

Drakon was lynched because he had two votes against him already when the time limit ran out. Re-read the thread and stop laying about random suspicion.

Pardon me but how did Drakon get two votes in your mind?

Edit:

Vote: Stalker21 too for misleading the thread.

[Stalker21]

Pardon me for making a mistake. And a nice golf clap to the both of you for giving the Mafia what they want: Another dead townie.

My vote stands, as I still believe ShadowSplicer too quick to thirst for blood on little to no evidence of anything.

Edit:
And after I am dead in the next lynching round, they will both say 'oops, sorry, we couldn't possibly know. But we know better now, and we are sure it is so-and-so who is the next mafia.' A Pox on all your houses. Get it? :P

[MalkThe2nd]

Don't edit, double post if you need to. :)


Why else would he be so keen on lynching someone with the goal of keeping everyone alive during the day?

As I already said, it's because Abstain does more to obfuscate matters than anything else. It would leave us with nearly nothing to talk about at all today and does nothing but help the mafia IMO.

Like you all, I figured Smurf had the DV. Easily explained because I'm pretty sure my vote was past the deadline. Strange that he claims to be responsible for Drakon's death yet not with a Double Vote. Not that I would trust him either way as that power isn't necessarily pro-town anyhow. Can't be Day Vigilante as we would have still had the normal lynch as well.


Either way, if the Mafia still thinks I am a double-vote power, why would they not kill me?

Because a mafia that earns the trust of the Double Voter wins, be it though a sacrifice, false info, ect.

[ShadowSplicer57]

Pardon me for making a mistake. *And a nice golf clap to the both of you for giving the Mafia what they want: Another dead townie.*

My vote stands, as I still believe ShadowSplicer too quick to thirst for blood on little to no evidence of anything.

Edit:
And after I am dead in the next lynching round, they will both say 'oops, sorry, we couldn't possibly know. *But we know better now, and we are sure it is so-and-so who is the next mafia.' *A Pox on all your houses. *Get it? * :P

The thing is that it wasn't simply a mistake, it was just flat out wrong information. Anyone could have easily seen, even by the posts on this very page that Drakon was not lynched under normal circumstances. It was a blatant attempt to mislead the thread and get the attention off yourself by whatever means possible. You would have checked your facts if you truly wanted us to go back and read the posts, but the fact that you did not go do that yourself points to it all being a convenient lie that you hoped would be overlooked.*
As early as it is in the game, this is about the most evidence we can possibly have by Day Two.
The dodging of the lynch. Even if Smurfy was indeed a Mafia Double Voter, why in the hell would he save an innocent you in order to take out a different innocent? Granted a daytime mafia investigator could have possibly investigated on Day One and then told Smurfy to go vote on him, but that's a bit much for a simple day one kill, that, if you indeed were innocent, would have happened for the Mafia all the same. Now, they could have done this just to put suspicion on you, but if that were to be true it'd be a whole lot easier for you to defend yourself. In your post above, you seemed fairly certain of your imminent doom, and offered only the defense that we would regret lynching you. On the verge of death in a game of all roles with powers, you would have made a role claim (you could possibly even prove it) rather than simply admitting defeat, but alas, this didn't happen. If it wasn't a double voter, then we can rightfully assume that it was a mafia power that spared you the death. Pox has indeed been known to give mob bosses such powers before, and the only reason to use it on day one would be to save a fellow mafia. A mafia investigation could have went into the switch to Drakon, but even if they were to have known his role, they could have lynched you and killed Drakon at night. Once again, if they were trying to pin this on you, there would have been a bigger defense.
And that's not counting the questionable flaws in your recent defense and Kilroy who inaccurately defended you against Xarboth with no real clear explanations as to why and he casually contradicts himself:

I know you didn't say anything earlier but it feels like a predatory decision to target Stalker, who has already been scrutinized by Malk, and at this point would constitute a lead culprit. Anyways I'm inclined to change my vote, I'm just trying to stimulate discusion.

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

I'll Un-Vote:Stalker21 to give people thoughts about who I am and what I can do for the town. If the majority of folks thinks I'm more of a burden than aid to the peoples, I will be more than willing to vote for myself if the town deems it worthy. I do not have a Jester or Suicide bomb power of sorts, I will claim that as well.

Stalker21 : I just don't like how your post was apparently well thought out but had the fundamental flaw of miscounting the votes somehow, which drags attention nothing but to the flaws of the post.

ShadowSplicer57 : Is the reason I'm un-voting, wordy response for something already self-apparent, clearly up to playing the blame-game.

I hold myself still responsible for the first day lynch, so if people are afraid of whatever my power is (And I won't say what it is) I will vote for myself to help the townsfolks.

[Beeva]

I still don't understand Smurfy's logic here.... If anything it sounds more like a double bluff :/

I'm still torn though, the whole lynching thing still doesn't smell right and it seems to be either Smurfy or Stalker. Still on the fence with you two atm.

[Xarboth]

Speaking of suspicion, my own falls upon ShadowSplicer and Xarboth. They both seem to be overly bloodthirsty, wanting to kill anyone before we even have proper time to develop founded suspicions.

This is the second time somebody's accused me of being overly aggressive and jumping to try and kill someone. Stalker, would you please, like Kilroy did, read back through my posts and try and find a quote from me that backs up your accusation? I don't think you'll find a single post where I've actually singled someone out and said they're acting suspiciously or tried to heap suspicion on anyone in any way. I've not even voted for anyone apart from my joke vote in the first day which I retracted well before the 48 hours were up.

All I've done so far is point out what facts we do know. We don't have all that much information at the moment, and for that reason, I've not suspected anyone strongly until now, and I think my posts have reflected that, so I don't know where you or Kilroy have got your information from.


Now, from what's been said recently, if Smurfy's telling the truth in that he doesn't have the double-vote power, it seems like somebody has the ability to nominate another person to make their vote count double. It's definitely happened in at least one other game I've played before. As has been stated by more than one person already, the only motivation for using such a power on Day 1 is to save a fellow mafia from the vote. So whether Smurfy has the power himself, or somebody else nominated Smurfy to double his vote and get rid of Drakon, the chances are that it was to save a fellow-mafia.

However, I think it's worth pointing out that this does not mean that they were saving Stalker. Malk's vote for Stalker came after any double-vote for Drakon. If Malk's vote for Stalker came first, then it would have been the casting vote, and Stalker would have died anyway.

So we know that (if our theory about the double-vote is right, irrespective of whether it's Smurfy's power or anyone else's) the double-vote came before Stalker was in huge danger. If the double vote saved a mafia, then it could be any of the 6 other people tied with him - there's actually nothing to suggest it was Stalker more than any others. Malk's vote for Stalker was coincidental. Now, Baragash was killed, so we can rule him out, but this means that if our double-vote theory is correct, the mafia member it's protecting is one (or more, I suppose) of either: Stalker; Doohicky; Smurfy; Kilroy; or Malk.

I hope people followed that - I'm pretty sure of my logic, but if there are any faults in my logic, feel free to point them out.

[Kilroy]

Perhaps it might be wise to also consider some sort of passive power affecting Stalker, or some sort of mason group power? I feel like it isn't a mafia power personally. Either a day kill power used by someone inexperienced or a passive power preventing him from being lynched. At a stretch Stalker is a mason with someone else, and that person decided to save him at Drakon's expense. The mafia would be foolish to waste something as useful as a vote redirect or a day kill so early in the game, especially when every dead townie counts for them.

[Loner]

Vote: Stalker21.

I still think that Stalker is one of the mafia's. Something just doesn't seem right about it...

[MalkThe2nd]

Wow guys, usually Day 2 isn't this lively. I love it!

I find myself agreeing with Kilroy that the particular power is likely to be a town mis-fire. It's possible that someone found themselves trusting Smurf's decision more than others and decided to back him. IDK, fients within feints within feints.. I'm not going to read much into it atm.

I think it bears pointing out that Pox stated that everyone has a power. If there are say 3 mafia members, it's very likely that only one of them has night kill while the other 2 have their own unique abilities.

[MalkThe2nd]

Plus it's fairly obvious that the mafia doesn't consist of all newish players. They went for Bara before he even really got a chance, anyone that's played on this forum would have known he'd be an asset.

[Strassa]

this is getting intense but i just cant shake the feeling that stalker is guilty or im just getting mind raped....

Vote: STALKER

[Stalker21]

You're being mind raped, Strassa. No one grieves Baragash's death more than I, and if you all lynch me you will all regret it as well. The only side that wins if I die is the Mafia.

[Strassa]

fine ill give you a vote of confidence.

unvote: STALKER
Vote: XARBOTH

[Xarboth]

Errr... do you want to give some kind of reason as to why you suspect me?

[Strassa]

blood thursty im the same way when im the mafia so that is my grounds and you are really giving it to stalker so hey why not go after the accuser instead of the accused

[Xarboth]

Did you bother to read my post? I've just explicitly stated that there's nothing to explicitly point to Stalker at all, and I've never once said that I suspect him. I'll state once again that I've never picked anyone out whatsoever as being suspicious, and I've not actually even voted for anyone yet besides the joke vote. You have no reason whatsoever to suspect me. You're just jumping on the bandwagon of Kilroy and Stalker - neither of whom actually had any reason for it either, and Kilroy unvoted me because I pointed out perfectly clearly that he had no grounds for his vote.

If you were a more experienced player, I'd be very suspicious of the fact that you've followed them into accusing me without any reason. However, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that Pox maybe PM'd you to remind you we'd started the game, since you didn't post at all during the first day, and that you've now realised you'd better contribute. But you first picked Stalker - I'm going to say simply because he seemed to be the most suspected; and then as soon as he complained, you changed your vote without giving a reason at first, and when pressed, you've jumped on another bandwagon and voted for me for reasons you've picked up from a quick skim of other posts.

I think you need to have a proper read through the thread. If you can quote a post from me that is actually bloodthirsty, and isn't taken wholly out of context, and you've not completely misread it, then fine. But I doubt you can. All I've done so far is state facts and try and offer possible explanations of those facts. Which is all any of us can really do at this phase.


Wow guys, usually Day 2 isn't this lively. I love it!


You're not wrong there, Malk.

[Kilroy]

There's a number of people i'd like to hear from. Most notably, Beeva, don't think he's posted at all, but generally anyone who hasn't posted today.

[Xarboth]

I think Beeva's posted a few times. The last was less than 12 hours ago, but you're right - there are a few who've not posted yet today I don't think. Pyro's not posted today either, actually.

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

Aye, I want to hear more from everyone else if possible as well. All I see is vote/revenge vote and Xarboth with some good logic to follow, but not taking sides and voting yet? I guess he's like me waiting for a few more contributions.

[Strassa]

i did read the thread and you did point out stalker and then recracted your statement, to shall we call it cover your tracks. You're very good at pointing out flaws in peoples arguements and thats why ultimatly i decided to retract my vote againsT stalker and vote toward you i think you are using your logic to manipulate people

[Beeva]

There's a number of people i'd like to hear from. Most notably, Beeva, don't think he's posted at all, but generally anyone who hasn't posted today.

Read the thread, dude :P

I am still working out the workings of the game to be honest. I've never played before so you'll forgive me if I am a little cautious. However I am of the thinking that we do have to lynch somebody or the game continues until we do. So I'll Vote: Stalker. Sorry dude, you may well be innocent and I'm not saying my mind won't change before the end of the voting period but at the moment that's my best guess.

Also, I may be wrong on this, but if someone does have an ability to double vote (theirs or someone elses), maybe it's wise to not spread the vote too much to allow them a casting vote.

[Doohicky]

I am actually leaning away from stalker.

I think strassa is more worrying. He seems to like jumping on the bandwagon and stalker has had some good posts.

vote strassa

[Xarboth]

i did read the thread and you did point out stalker and then recracted your statement, to shall we call it cover your tracks.

No, Strassa. The closest I've come to saying anything about Stalker is this:

Hmm. I'm right in thinking the lynch should have been on Stalker21, aren't I?
And I wasn't saying we should all be lynching him. All I was doing was counting votes. At that point it seemed like Stalker had received the final vote to be lynched, but wasn't. So I said that. Once again, stating facts.

Now, as for your latest argument against me:

You're very good at pointing out flaws in peoples arguements and thats why ultimatly i decided to retract my vote againsT stalker and vote toward you i think you are using your logic to manipulate people

You're voting against me because I'm thinking logically? I'm finding the flaw in logical arguments, and proposing logical options to explain the facts we already know, and that makes you think I'm mafia? If I was mafia, I'd allow people to continue believing flawed arguments because flawed logic misleads people. I've not manipulated anyone. I've stated facts and drawn conclusions. I've even invited people to question my logic and point out any flaws in it if they find any. How is that, in any way, manipulative or misleading people?

Before, I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt as a new player. Now, I'm less convinced. I think you're deliberately trying to draw attention onto me because you see that I'm thinking logically and productively through the facts that have come to light, and from what you're saying, you come across as mafia trying to get rid of a threat.

Vote: Strassa

(And before anyone says it's a revenge vote, it's not. I didn't 'revenge vote' Kilroy earlier when he suspected me and voted for me; I didn't 'revenge vote' Stalker earlier when he said I was suspicious; and I didn't 'revenge vote' Strassa when he first voted for me either. I argued my point first of all, like I did with Kilroy and Stalker, and Strassa has continued accusing me despite the fact that both his earlier argument and his latest argument are factually and logically incorrect. That's what is suspicious to me.)

[Kilroy]

If you are, as you claim to be, a large threat, why would an intelligent and thoughtful mafia try and kill you during the day? Especially with weak evidence against you? If you are truly a large threat, they would leave you alone during the day and kill you during the night (See: Baragash). If the mafia try to lead the vote and lynch to their advantage, they will usually target a weaker link in the town. This, it seems, is closer to what you are doing. I'm inclined to agree with Strassa on this one actually. You are using logic to lead attention away from yourself. Although I admit you weren't as bloodthirsty as you appeared at the beginning of the day, you seem to believe the fact that not being bloodthirsty absolves you of guilt. After Dohicky started the vote against Strassa you were quite quick to jump on it, especially with vote time coming to a close and no one (initially) defending him. If I had to pick out the mafia right now, I'd say it was Xarboth, Doohicky and Malk.

To counterbalance the vote against Strassa, I'm going to go ahead and Unvote: Malk and Vote: Xarboth

If he is mafia and is trying to start a bandwagon against you (Albeit a weak one), I'd honestly be surprised. I'll pull my vote once someone pulls theirs from Strassa.

[Strassa]

justice shall find its way!!!!!

[MalkThe2nd]

Ugh, comp screwed up and ate my post... let's try this again.

Really we don't have much of anything solid to go on yet so I'll have to follow my gut.

I think I suspect Kilroy the most at the moment for several reasons.

First, because he was early to call out lurkers but never really seemed to follow through on that. Loner is someone I'm looking at the moment but I'll get there in a bit.

Second, Kilroy is very quick to dismiss the thought that the vote power could be mafia. I know if i was a mafioso and had that power... I would most certainly use it wherever I could and eventually claim it. While I personally think it's pro-town, I certainly don't trust that person as it's dangerous even in the right hands. One of Kilroy's own games featured a possible mafia triple vote with the Slaneesh character. *cough*

Third, is because of his shift to Xarboth. This early, mafia votes are very valuable as the town will tend to be split. Early votes can be an attempt to distance oneself from targets or teammates. The shift from his previous suspect (me) is offered with a flimsy reason, setting a tie that the mafia can easily break. Also, his promise to retract his vote to re-set the tie troubles me.

Vote: Kilroy Yeah yeah, revenge vote rabble rabble.


On to other peeps:
To me, Stalker seems like the typical confused townie reading to much into what everyone says about him Day 2. His non-defense almost screams perfect defense. I trust him atm.

Loner, on the other hand, screams bored mafia. He's posted just enough to slip by, hasn't added any thoughts, and gives a passing suspicion followed by a quick vote.
FoS: Loner

Xarboth I feel uneasy about. He seems almost like he's posting too much, responding to every small slight. IIRC this isn't too far off his normal play, like I said before it seems like he feels the need to "work harder"

PyroSikTh I summon you. Lurker vote coming soon.

[Kilroy]

I won't lie, I don't like the low profile actors very much. Loner and Doohicky spring to mind. However I don't think Strassa is guilty, and I don't find it fair that Doohicky and Xarboth have suddenly picked him up as an easy target. Anyways what frustrates me is the fact that there are 4 or 5 truly active players. Here I am trying to cover all the bases, not with much help might I add.

Anyways your criticisms of me don't paint me as a member of the mafia, but rather highly distracted at worst. You blame me for not going after the lurkers when you yourself don't vote for them. I suppose that's one of the great conundrums of this game. The players who are the most active will always attract more negative attention.

[Loner]

Seems that people are becoming suspicious of me because I write short posts.
(I'm quite lazy and my posts are almost never longer than 5 sentences...)

So, here we go:
Stalker, ever since I saw your first post, I was suspecting you. Why lynch Baragash? We have nothing that could back it up.
You mentioned after that you always died early and that you always were innocent. Doesn't that appear kinda awkward for a second post? Sure it was as defence to ShadowSplicer, but as he said, it was a joke vote.
Now, you should have died the first day, but for some miracle, it didn't. Now why would someone do that? I can't think of another reason other than that you are a maffia.
And to make matters even worse: Baragash died the first night. This is very strange to happen.
Now to make things worse, some people voted against Stalker, but once Stalker said: "I'm innocent, I'm a townie," Strassa shifted over.
Now why would someone fall for a reason like that? Let's face it, you can't trust anyone here.
So I think that Stalker as well as Strassa are part of the maffia.

Therefore I'm suspecting Stalker and pointed it out several times, hoping that I wasn't the only one.

(The post is long enough now, Killroy, Malk?)

[Xarboth]

After Dohicky started the vote against Strassa you were quite quick to jump on it,

Doohicky's post was actually not there when I started writing my essay, to be fair.


I'll pull my vote once someone pulls theirs from Strassa.

This comment worries me, to be honest. Do you think I'm mafia or not? If you think I'm mafia, why would you pull the vote? If you don't think I'm mafia, why vote me in the first place? Just vote for who you think is mafia, and stop jumping around with your vote.

[Xarboth]

He seems almost like he's posting too much, responding to every small slight.

Actually, I'm just unemployed there days! Had a job last time we played mafia. And of course I'm going to defend myself from accusations that have no grounding. Kilroy's latest accusations don't offend me nearly so much as "You're bloodthirsty and trying to get us all to lynch Stalker" when I've been the one saying "There's no evidence that points specifically to Stalker."

[Doohicky]

I have broken laptop so am posting from phone which is why my posts are short.
I am still makings sure to post at least once per day.

Can someone with easier access than me do a check on if anyone has not posted this day phase, or only posted once?

[Xarboth]

Pyro's the only person to have only posted once. Shadowsplicer's posted twice but has been lying low for a long time. Everyone's at least posted once this day phase though.

[Stalker21]

Stalker, ever since I saw your first post, I was suspecting you. Why lynch Baragash? We have nothing that could back it up.
Are you suggesting I somehow lynched Baragash? Because if you are, please remember I voted to abstain from the lynching on the first day.

You mentioned after that you always died early and that you always were innocent. Doesn't that appear kinda awkward for a second post? Sure it was as defence to ShadowSplicer, but as he said, it was a joke vote.
You may see it as awkward, but the simple fact is, it's the truth. Of the few of these games I've played, I typically die within the first couple of rounds. If I'm not lynched in this phase, I will be heartily surprised.

Now, you should have died the first day, but for some miracle, it didn't. Now why would someone do that? I can't think of another reason other than that you are a maffia.
I can think of a reason, and you are exemplifying the reason right now. Suspicion. If I were a Mafia member, or an insane townie, I would do something of that sort to throw suspicion on the nearly-lynched townie. And oh, look what's happening out of that little fiasco.[/b[]

And to make matters even worse: Baragash died the first night. This is very strange to happen.
[b]Again, how does this have any bearing on your reasoning/logic to vote to lynch me?

Now to make things worse, some people voted against Stalker, but once Stalker said: "I'm innocent, I'm a townie," Strassa shifted over.
Now why would someone fall for a reason like that? Let's face it, you can't trust anyone here.
So I think that Stalker as well as Strassa are part of the maffia.

Therefore I'm suspecting Stalker and pointed it out several times, hoping that I wasn't the only one.

(The post is long enough now, Killroy, Malk?)

Your logic has a few holes, but I can clearly see that I am the bandwagon for this round. If it is the will of the town, I will go to the headsman. Don't come crying to me when the mafia slit your throats.

[yWizePapaSmurfy]

It's hard to judge anyone else, including Pyro, at the moment but:

Xarboth - I think he has good intentions, but full on essays still put him on my "To Watch" book. I was the same way my first time playing however, didn't know a fine line yet.

Stalker21 - It's still hard to justify whether his first flaw'd post was a genuine mistake or a mis-lead. I'm guessing mistake, mostly because I think everyone knows they can check through the thread, lol

Doohicky - Being hard to judge again due to technical problems...He's used this excuse before but, I have nothing else to go off.

Malkthe2nd - Really, neutral, he's another target I'm watching because of said neutrality. I don't like how he goes on a tangent vote. As bad as taking sides is, you can more easily possibly tell alliances develop, intentionally (Mafia) or unintentionally.

Kilroy - Meh? He's bounced around everywhere but I don't see anything that stands out about him.

Beeva - About the same

Which leaves me to Vote: Strassa I don't like how he has not much to contribute, and given he's new to the game is no excuse to not help in analyzing the Day Phase but "acting in character"

[Beeva]

I'm liking this game! :D

Quite how you're supposed to tell who the mafia are purely on suspicious. Behaviour I don't know. Right now I can think of good reasons to suspect pretty much everyone.

Kilroy's logic just seems too flawed right now, quite why he trusts Strassa and not some of the other 'lurkers' I don't know. Offering to unvote Xarboth seems just... odd.

Strassa hasn't done all that much apart from possibly being clumsy with his voting but the way he's being villified and defended despite posting very little is strange. I think if Strassa is mafia, then so is Kilroy and vice versa.

Stalker, if innocent will be rather unfortunate but as the only one with anything looking like solid,evidence against him....

Keeping my vote as is right now but it's wavering a little.

[Pox]

Current Vote Count (As far as can tell - remember to place our unvotes in bold as well, so don't double count.)

Stalker 3 votes
Strassa 3 votes
Xarboth 2 votes
Kilroy 1 vote

Majority: 6 votes needed.

[ShadowSplicer57]

My vote is staying where it is, there's simply too much evidence against Stalker to justify going for a lynch on Strassa because of some rather clumsy posts. I also find it rather interesting that his votecount should suddenly tie up with Stalker's when he had gathered three votes. I've already stated the reasons I don't trust Stalker, and I still stick with them as there hasn't been much in the way of counter-evidence other than: "Don't vote for me or you'll meet your doom! DOOM!"

[Beeva]

Majority: 6 votes needed.[/b]

Can I get clarrification?

6 of us need to vote for one person in order for that person to be lynched?

[PyroSikTh]

Woah, sorry guys. Seems I've missed a LOT. For those of you not aware, I don't actually have internet, so I have to steal it from the parents whenever I'm over, which is every other day at the absolute longest...thus why I didn't post at all yesterday. Trust this or not, I'm certainly no lurker. I can't help but speak my mind on issues that crop up, whatever the subject.

So, it's time for me to get speaking. I'm noticing a lot of back and forth, and a lot of unvoting. However everyone seems to standing firm on their claims either way. I thought this was something interesting to point out.

Kilroy, Xarboth, and Stalker all appear to be playing the defensive game at the moment. In my opinion, the only contributions they've made have been to defend themselves against the votes they've received, and thus voting against whoever voted them.

Malk and Smurfy seem to be playing the individual judgment game, singling people out and describing their thoughts on them (much like what I'm doing I suppose). They've done nothing to incriminate themselves yet, so they're safe from my vote for now.

Loner, Beeva and Doohicky I don't have much to go on, so for now they're also safe. For what it's worth, being in a position where I'm set up to be suspected as lurker means that I won't judge those with short and/or rare posts.

My vote, however, has to go to Strassa. The way he was so easy to change his vote gets the suspicion alarm flaring. Whether it's the truth or not, he appears to have some kind of co-operation going on with Stalker. Whether this is townie co-operation or Mafia co-operation is anyone's guess, but either way I find it fishy.

Vote: Strassa

I also want to point out something Loner touched on, which may gimp me a bit;
On the first day, my vote for Baragash was the only one noted (with, I think Stalker? retracting his). Once he died on the first Night, I wholly expected some suspicions pointing at me to flair. I find it interesting to note that nothing did. In fact, everyone seems to have forgotten my vote for Baragash on the opening day...

[Xarboth]

On the first day, my vote for Baragash was the only one noted (with, I think Stalker? retracting his). Once he died on the first Night, I wholly expected some suspicions pointing at me to flair. I find it interesting to note that nothing did. In fact, everyone seems to have forgotten my vote for Baragash on the opening day...
It was me that joke voted Bara then retracted it. Voting on the first day is so uninformed that looking at voting patterns from the first day also tends to be generally uninformative.

Night-killing the same person you've tried to get lynched is a pointless mafia tactic, as if you make any headway in starting a bandwagon against them, then you've a decent chance of getting them lynched the next day. So you'd probably leave them alive in the night and vote them off next day. However, being the first day no-one ever manages a bandwagon, so that wouldn't help anyway. That's why nobody's picked up on you voting Bara and then him dying in the night - it's not really particularly shifty at all.

[PyroSikTh]

If I was mafia, one tactic I would use would be to stage a townie, by voting off someone in the Night that that townie voted for in the Day. Thus all the other townies gang up on that townie and do the work for me. I'd get rid of two people with just 1 vote. But that's just me and what I'd do if I was mafia.

Was just a thought that some might find interesting. Of course, me voicing the thought might point to me double-bluffing, in which case I'd be Mafia staging myself up, then explaining the stage-up to get people to side with me against others. However, voicing that it could be a double-bluff probably indicates many things in itself...

I'm talking too much, but apologies to Stalker for thinking it was you joke-voting Bara. There's a lot in this thread to keep track of.

[Xarboth]

If I was mafia, one tactic I would use would be to stage a townie, by voting off someone in the Night that that townie voted for in the Day. Thus all the other townies gang up on that townie and do the work for me. I'd get rid of two people with just 1 vote. But that's just me and what I'd do if I was mafia.

I think it's more common for it to happen the other way around. If you'd given heavy justification for your vote on Bara and people started to agree but Bara not been killed, the mafia would kill you off and frame Bara for it saying he killed off someone who was a threat. But there's also something in what you suggest too.

[Xarboth]

And yes, Beeva. 10 people left, we need an overall majority to cut the day short and get an immediate lynch. So if there are 6 votes on one person at any point, the day ends and the lynch happens. However, if we get to the voting deadline without reaching 6 votes on one person, the person with the most votes is lynched.

Obviously as we lose more people, the number of votes for a majority decreases.

[Beeva]

Right. Got it. So only if there is an impass after the deadline it will go to 'next vote kills' ?

[MalkThe2nd]

Yeah, if deadline is hit w/o a majority then it goes to highest vote count. In the result of a tie at deadline, next vote kills. (Assuming a power doesn't interfere)

Honestly, I put very little stock on anything that happens Day 1. We had a more srs D1 than most games do, but usually everyone is just trying to pass the time until deadline forces a lynch.

[Pox]

Right. Got it. So only if there is an impass after the deadline it will go to 'next vote kills' ?

After the first day phase the deadline is increased to 7 days to allow a good conversation, but after that time yes the highest voted for person is lynched to keep the game moving if you guys cannot decide amongst yourself in that generous time frame.

[Kilroy]

Strassa, you might want to speak up for yourself.

[Strassa]

in my defense I also have a broken computer so i can only post very short post while i am at work. I just saw that xarboth posted originally saying that stalker was had put a scheme in place and got all the attention towards stalker, which is what i would do if i was the mafia. I would try to get all the attention away from me, but look at him sweat look at him pound me into the ground with accusation after accusation, when all i did was put a little attention his way. I would say the pure barrage of defense he throws out is an example of his guilt. If you choose to vote for me im fine with dying a martyr so that justice can find its way, but of course I hope you don't.

[Xarboth]

But I didn't ever say that Stalker had 'put a scheme in place', or anything even remotely like that. So when you accused me of accusing Stalker of things, when I'd done no such thing (but you had because you voted for Stalker at first, did you not? Let's not forget that), of course I defended myself.


but look at him sweat look at him pound me into the ground with accusation after accusation
Seriously? That's how you interpret my actions? I'm not sweating, and I've hardly 'pounded you into the ground'. I simply pointed out that your accusations of me have absolutely no grounding. I've invited you at least once before, and I invite you again, to read through every single one of my posts and quote back to me the part when I suggest that Stalker's mafia. You've not managed to do that yet, but you're still accusing me and that's the one fact that your accusation rests entirely on. If you can't back it up with evidence, then yeah, I'm going to get suspicious eventually, when you keep accusing me and failing to back it up.

And 'accusation after accusation'? All I ever accused you of was getting your facts wrong at first, but you've persisted in your accusations without providing evidence - even after I've asked you to do so - and that's when I voted for you.

[Strassa]

Hmm. I'm right in thinking the lynch should have been on Stalker21, aren't I? So either Stalker21 has a defensive ability that lynched Drakon instead of him,or someone else has a day kill ability that they used before Malk changed his vote.

Now, if it was Stalker, the most common defensive ability is to kill off the person to cast the final vote, isn't it? Which should have been Malk.

So the two options are a vigilante/mafia with day kill ability; or the fact that Stalker can nominate who gets lynched instead of him, either each time he'd be lynched or a one-off ability for the first time.

.

this may not be you going out and saying LETS LYNCH STALKER but you brought attention to him with i dont think any grounds. After which you did not let up until i confronted you and then you put all your energy into me. All of this deflecting your doing seems to be a bit....sketchy to me. Pox simply lost track of the lynching vote, i dont think stalker has a anti lynching ability. I feel as if you started putting guilt on stalker because he was the easiest to pin guilt on while you hide in plain sight being the innocent who brings justice by day and then at night you will kill one of us off. All of you who have voted for me I implore you to take another look at what is going on I am not able to make a sound arguement because of time restrictions but i hope this little bit helped.

P.S this was also the VERY first post to bring stalker in the question thus Xarboths doing

[MalkThe2nd]

this may not be you going out and saying LETS LYNCH STALKER but you brought attention to him with i dont think any grounds.

I'm not sure if you're just misinterpreting the quote you posted, or trying to mislead. What Xarboth said there was pointing out the fact that Stalker should have been lynched on Day 1 as a matter of fact, based solely on our knowledge of the tally. Then he goes on to give a theory of why that didn't happen.

I don't see any "malice" to Stalker there at all.

[Strassa]

i feel as if he was trying to bring attention to stalker. thats why i said its not as if he was saying lets lynch stalker. just simply bringing attention to something can have the desired effect. which is why i tried that with xarboth and now im next on the chopping block. but its ok my death will be bitter sweet because it will only bring xarboth to light when it turns out im innocent

[Kilroy]

Really? The "You'll regret this decision when I'm dead!" defense? :/

[Xarboth]

Hmm. I'm right in thinking the lynch should have been on Stalker21, aren't I? So either Stalker21 has a defensive ability that lynched Drakon instead of him,or someone else has a day kill ability that they used before Malk changed his vote.

I stated the fact that Stalker should have been the one to get lynched. So I counted up some votes and worked out that Stalker had the most. But it was Drakon who got lynched. This paragraph was my reaction to the surprise of seeing Drakon lynched. And the fact that Drakon was lynched when it appeared that Stalker had the most votes against him tells us that some other power was used. This is an old discussion, and we now believe that somebody has a double-vote power. Either Smurfy's vote always counts double (which he's denied and which would seem unbalanced to me, so probably not the right option), or somebody else has a separate power in which they nominate someone whose vote counts double.

However, the double-vote option hadn't occurred to me at that point. That was pointed out by someone else shortly afterwards. I came up with 2 possible options for why Drakon died when Stalker had most votes:
1. Stalker had a defensive ability which saved him from being lynched. This was always an unlikely option, but it's always worth covering all bases.
2. Someone else could have had a day kill ability and used it to kill Drakon before Malk voted for Stalker. This option is now more-or-less ruled out by the fact that a day kill wouldn't stop a lynching from happening - as someone else pointed out.

So I was suggesting options to explain the facts, inviting discussion. It worked - we ruled out both options and someone else suggested the double-vote option.

Also note: never at one point did I say that I thought option 1 was a mafia power. Having a defensive power like option 1 suggested would be fairly overpowered for mafia and is usually a pro-town power, in fact.


Now, if it was Stalker, the most common defensive ability is to kill off the person to cast the final vote, isn't it? Which should have been Malk.

This comment is analysing the effects of Option 1 above. If Stalker had had a defensive ability which prevented him from being lynched, then the most common effect is for the person who cast the last vote on them to be lynched or otherwise killed instead. However, the last vote on Stalker was from Malk and it was Drakon who was killed. So this second paragraph was me thinking things through and more-or-less ruling out Option 1, unless Stalker had a defensive ability by which he nominated who was killed instead of him.




So the two options are a vigilante/mafia with day kill ability; or the fact that Stalker can nominate who gets lynched instead of him, either each time he'd be lynched or a one-off ability for the first time.

Concluding my post with the results of my thinking:
Option 1. Stalker had a defensive ability that enabled him to nominate someone to die in his place when lynched. This - again - doesn't mean Stalker would be mafia. And if it had happened and he activated that power, he'd have had to pick at random who should die. So option 1 states that Stalker simply has an ability. Not necessarily a mafia ability. And that Drakon was simply in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Option 2. Someone has a day kill ability.


That explains my exact thought process for that post. Bear in mind that at this point nobody had really said anything, and the possibility of a double-vote power hadn't occurred to me. I wish it had - it'd have saved me a LOT of trouble!

Now...

this may not be you going out and saying LETS LYNCH STALKER but you brought attention to him with i dont think any grounds.
You're right - I didn't have any grounds to suspect Stalker and draw attention to him. That's because I wasn't. I was drawing attention to the fact that Drakon had been killed and that was odd. It got discussed and we have more-or-less concluded that there's a double-vote power somewhere. Positive discussion drawing logical conclusions from true facts. = Town benefit.


After which you did not let up until i confronted you and then you put all your energy into me

'Let up' on what? I wasn't accusing Stalker of anything in the first place. I'm pretty sure most other people can see that, but you keep on bringing it up. Which is why I've had to put so much energy into arguing with you - every time I explain my actions clearly and logically, you ignore everything I say. Fine, you don't believe me. So you voted for me (although I think you voted for me first then thought of a reason and now you're having to stick to it or you'll have to change votes again and you KNOW that will look bad for you) and you stuck with it. There's no need to have had a circular argument about the same fact again and again. We all get it. You think I look shifty because i KEEP ON defending myself time and time again... Well, that's because I keep on being accused of the same thing time and time again - even after I address it, you come back and state the same accusation over again.


Pox simply lost track of the lynching vote, i dont think stalker has a anti lynching ability

We know that now. By the time you made your first post, we'd had several discussions about it. What you fail to realise is that when my above post was made, we hadnt worked that out yet. That post, and the whole discussion around Stalker not being lynched was integral to us working out what you had the benefit of just turning up and reading when you finally came to post.


I feel as if you started putting guilt on stalker because he was the easiest to pin guilt on

I didn't put guilt on Stalker. I've never voted for him and have consistently stated that his survival doesn't point him out as mafia at all.


P.S this was also the VERY first post to bring stalker in the question thus Xarboths doing

That's because it was the very first post with any content whatsoever in Day 2. Whatever I'd said would have been the first post to bring something into question!

[Xarboth]

I found it hilarious that after typing all that, I then clicked "Post quick reply"! Sorry about the wall of text (to anyone who gets all the way through it).

[Loner]

Pox we now have a week instead of 48 hours, before a day/night passes?

[Loner]

It seems kinda long to be honest.

(That is the reason why I wanted to verify it.)

[Loner]

May I edit all of that into one post?...

[Kilroy]

Essays, essays everywhere. I think there should be a new rule about concise statements :/

[Pox]

Pox we now have a week instead of 48 hours, before a day/night passes?

that is correct. Yes it is a long time because it is the maximum time i will let you guys dally around before forcing a day end. You should EASILY have come to a majority vote before a week, but this way gives you lotsa time to talk and still a deadline just in case.

[Beeva]

Ok... so.... I guess some of us need to think about changing our votes or this will just drag on. I'm open to ideas on how we want to do that. Second choices?

[Pox]

Ok... so.... I guess some of us need to think about changing our votes or this will just drag on. I'm open to ideas on how we want to do that. Second choices?

you can UNVOTE (please do so in bold so it is not missed) then re-vote for someone else. Feel free to change your mind as much as you desire with the information at hand. Once 6 people do agree on one person though the day will end or will drag on till end of week period.

Their is no second vote, or finger of suspicion etc.

[Beeva]

Yep, sorry that is what I meant. Just thought that between us we. Could work out a system whereby we can unite behind one candidate.

I'd perhaps suggest eliminating those with the fewest votes, but I'm not sure that would work under the circumstances. Our speculations have started to go around in circles.

[Kilroy]

What's the rush on getting someone killed Beeva? Anxious for the night phase?

[Strassa]

i do find it wierd how after all the heat I took off of stalker he has not said a thing, but i still think xarboth is guilty

[Stalker21]

I laid out my own plea of my innocence as well as laid out my own suspicions. I did not feel the need to pad my post count by continuing to fight, since my opinion (which is all any of us have in this game) will not in and of itself change my opponent's suspicions of me. All I can say is I am an innocent, whether any of you believe me or not. I had nothing to do with my so-called lynch-dodge or Baragash's night phase death.

My vote stands as stated for the reasons previously stated. And I do apologize to Xarboth for taking his laying out of what he has seen, as an attack on myself. I just felt very spotlighted with my name said so many times in non-linear connection with both Drakon's and Baragash's deaths. VOTE: ShadowSplicer

[MalkThe2nd]

Their is no.. finger of suspicion etc.

I know I know, I just liked it and enjoy using it even if it doesn't "count".


I'd perhaps suggest eliminating those with the fewest votes, but I'm not sure that would work under the circumstances. Our speculations have started to go around in circles.

I find myself agreeing with your sentiment.

Unvote: Kilroy

Singe votes are basically unused and even though Strassa is in the lead by one (I'm pretty sure...) that still leaves wiggle room for the mafia to pay with. Ties can be very bad for us, especially this early in the game.

Worst case scenario is that not only Strassa a townie, but everyone that votes for him is town but I feel that is unlikely. I think his style is too temping for the mafia to pass as a free lynch even if he's anti-town as that would be a good move to distance oneself. So that not only do I feel that it's more likely Strassa is mafia than Stalker, but I feel almost certain one of the people already voting for him is anti-town. Just want to get that bit in in case I die before D3 heh.

Vote: Strassa

[PyroSikTh]

I've got a new idea, maybe those who are Mafia should raise their hands. That way we can kill them off quick and swift!

Seriously though, I think Malk raises a good point about Strassa. Even if he is Mafia, the way the mob is against him gives other Mafia an opportunity to blend in with the crowd by offing their own. However, I don't think it's wise to be giving Mafia ideas on how to play the game, unless you're Mafia yourself...

[Kilroy]

Does no one feel like challenging this potential lynch? I seriously hate how easily Strassa is getting written off, but I suppose that's a symptom of being an inexperienced player.

[PyroSikTh]

Me and Beeva have never played Mafia before, but we haven't received a single vote between us yet this phase. I hardly think being inexperienced is a reason to let them live on, especially if they turn out being Mafia. Of course we could all be wrong, in which case it's his inexperience that did it.

[Kilroy]

Perhaps, but on the other hand, you and Beeva are keeping a low profile. Beeva hasn't actually voted yet and you jumped on the Strassa bandwagon after 3 or 4 people had already voted for him, in your first day 2 post.

[Beeva]

What's the rush on getting someone killed Beeva? Anxious for the night phase?


Why so eager to keep the day phase going? Voting not to your liking? Oh and you may want to read post #84 on page 5.

You see, you've pointed out a couple of times about my 'lack of posting' but I've actually posted a fair few times on Day 2. More times than Pyro or Strassa yet for some reason, you seem to be trying to protect Strassa but trying to cast doubt on me and Pyro. Don't you find that odd?

[Doohicky]

I don't really have anything to add. Just reiterating that I still stand by my vote and see no reason to change it.

[Kilroy]

I don't find it odd, because I think Strassa is innocent whereas I think you and Pyro may or may not be guilty. My bad though for missing the vote, I didn't see it inside the text. And in regards to everyone who blames Strassa for jumping on the bandwagon, I think its important to remember that, at the time, Xarboth had no votes for him.

[Beeva]

I think Strassa is innocent whereas I think you and Pyro may or may not be guilty

Care to elucidate?

[Loner]

Kilroy just double post, do't edit your messages. :)

Also PyroSikTh not stressing a bit much you're not a mafia?

[Kilroy]

In my experience, the guy who blunders in the foreground and who attracts all the attention is rarely the mafia, save in the cases with inexperienced players who aren't aware of the dynamics in the game. They usually happen to be the kind of player who makes a few astute sounding observations, uses logic to avoid being lynched and when the call to vote comes, jumps on a bandwagon fairly early. Even in the circumstance that Strassa is a member of the mafia, I feel that he is significantly less dangerous, than, say the players that recognize Baragash as a threat.

Also it makes literally no sense to me that Strassa be set up for lynching for misreading Xarboth's statement, and for pursuing him.

I won't lie this is all mostly my gut feeling about things, but when provided with little to no information about the nature of a crime, gut is really a better approach than blaming the most obvious threat, to get the day over with.

[MalkThe2nd]

Also it makes literally no sense to me that Strassa be set up for lynching for misreading Xarboth's statement, and for pursuing him.

I'd just like to say, I'm not really voting Strassa for that particular reason. I'm mainly going off of how I feel about that way he's been going about attacking Xarboth. Even when things he said were countered, he just kept going trying topush the issue.

Without proper evidence, and no support votes on people I suspect, the only way to make my vote useful is to either try and save Strassa with a vote on Stalker, or to put Strassa farther ahead. Between the two, I suspect Strassa more. Mafia votes tend to carry little power until end-game... except in the instance of a tie. I'm not willing to let a mafia player break one when it's possible we already have one of them in out grasp.

[MalkThe2nd]

However, I don't think it's wise to be giving Mafia ideas on how to play the game, unless you're Mafia yourself...

Not exactly letting the cat out of the bag, sacrifice is a pretty common ploy used to gain trust. Sometimes it works, sometimes it just helps the town find you.

If I was mafia, and was telling other mafia how to play... I'd do it in PM of course! Not sure if srs or just being tricky.

[Xarboth]

I'd just like to say, I'm not really voting Strassa for that particular reason. I'm mainly going off of how I feel about that way he's been going about attacking Xarboth. Even when things he said were countered, he just kept going trying topush the issue.

This is exactly my reasoning. I didn't vote for him until the second or third time he pushed the same theory even after I'd countered. To be honest, if he'd not responded to my explanations and left his vote on me, I probably wouldn't be suspicious of him, ironically.

Also, this is how he explained his voting for me in the post where he did vote for me:

fine ill give you a vote of confidence.

unvote: STALKER
Vote: XARBOTH


He didn't. Switched vote without even bothering with an explanation. Said he thought Stalker was guilty and voted for him, but then stalker said "The only people who win if I die is the mafia" and he switched to voting me without a reason given. It didn't seem he cared who he voted for as long as he voted for someone at that point.

[PyroSikTh]

He didn't. Switched vote without even bothering with an explanation. Said he thought Stalker was guilty and voted for him, but then stalker said "The only people who win if I die is the mafia" and he switched to voting me without a reason given. It didn't seem he cared who he voted for as long as he voted for someone at that point.

This is why I voted for Strassa. No explanation as to why, and no fight against Stalker. Just a plain and simple switch. Mafia or not, I'm not comfortable having someone with an obvious bias towards one player and against another (the way he accepted Stalker's lacklustre reason, but not Xarboths lengthy and logical reasons).

Also, as I was a bit lacking thanks to a chock-full Monday where I couldn't access internet, I had a whole load after that to read which, in my opinion, made Strassa out to look even worse. Of course I could just be a sucker for Xarboth's logic, but it is sound.



Also PyroSikTh not stressing a bit much you're not a mafia?

How so? I haven't denied (nor claimed) I'm Mafia at all.

[Loner]

UNVOTE: STALKER
VOTE: STRASSA
I think that the evidence is pretty obvious.

As for Pyrosikth, you're often saying: "If I were mafia, I would do this and this." or "I think that the mafia should be doing this and this."
It sounds a bit too enthusiastic to me.
For instance the last sentence also got me wondering. Perhaps a bit dumb, but just for the show: Are you a mafia?

[Pox]

As everyone sits around doing the maths, pointing fingers and generally laying blame to the most heinous death of Baragash a decision is reached and the mob descent upon the poor Strassa who fumbles some sort of defence before he generally knifed, kicked and beaten. It is only after Strassa lays dead upon the floor that people start to investigate what his role in this whole operation was...

Strassa = Vox operator, can anonymously give a message at the start of each day phase as part of the day phase text.

with the only person who can call for back-up killed, looks like you are all alone again.

Night Phase 2 starts, and you have 48hours to decide what ye are all doing.

[Kilroy]

|:\

[Strassa]

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[PyroSikTh]

As for Pyrosikth, you're often saying: "If I were mafia, I would do this and this." or "I think that the mafia should be doing this and this."
It sounds a bit too enthusiastic to me.
For instance the last sentence also got me wondering. Perhaps a bit dumb, but just for the show: Are you a mafia?

I'm literally just speaking my thoughts, and my thoughts often go round in circles, contradict each other, and cover all bases. The point of the last sentence was that I haven't let on either way. I could be, I could not be. Who knows? Well me obviously.

[MalkThe2nd]

I'll add to that when Day starts. For now... it's time to sleep and let the night actions play out.

[Pox]

bit sleepy now, so will try to update before going to work tommorow, so a bit more time to stew wonder if you are dead and get those last actions in.

[Pox]

The morning breaks and it is another tale of woe, as people find Papasmurf tied to a chair, and his body adorned with a thousand cuts, most notably his throat being split from ear to ear. As if that was not enough to scare everyone it seem that Stalker has not left his room, upon closer inspection you find his body laying on the ground of his room with his neck twisted at an odd angle - the work of a professional indeed, you do not have to go far to find the culprit though as right in front of him is Shadowsplicer now a wreckage of a person for it seemed that after the death of Baragash - Stalker had been laying traps for Shadowsplicer and this time finally got him.

Papasmurf - Commissar (double voter)
Stalker - innocent lover (pro-town)
Shadowsplicer - Callidus assassin (pro-town)

The noose tightened around the remaining loyal citizens.

[Beeva]

O.o

Someone explain to me what just happened!! :/

[ShadowSplicer57]

Oh god... *Facepalms*

Epic fail? Epic fail.

[Doohicky]

Someone targetted me last night which should prove my innocence to them at least. Pm me if you do not want to reveal yourself.

How did 3 die. One assassin, one Mafia. 3rd I have no idea.

[Xarboth]

Er...wow.

It says that Stalker had been setting traps for SS and finally got him, so maybe Stalker had a night kill ability, and SS being an assassin had a power to revenge-kill someone who targets him in the night, or someone who night-kills him?


Stalker had been laying traps for Shadowsplicer and this time finally got him.

This, and the fact that they were found together seems to suggest it was Smurfy who was mafia killed? Not that I guess that actually matters at this point. So we've got 6 town dead out of 12? How many mafia do we think there are? It seemed like 3 earlier, but 6 dead and no mafia down? Are we still thinking 3 mafia?

[Xarboth]

Sorry, I meant 6 out of 13 dead.

[Doohicky]

Just to add I was role blocked. I don't think saying I have a night ability will be a problem as we all have some sort of avlbility.

I was right about papasmurf too. 8)

I am just hoping my blocker wasn't stalker.
We can post what you sent us can't we pox?

[Loner]

What does lover mean, more as in, what function does it have in this game?

[Doohicky]

What does lover mean, more as in, what function does it have in this game?

The name is why I am worries he was my blocker.
my reply from pox states that I was blocked in a good way and had a smile for the rest of the day.

Did I get jiggy with stalker?:shock:

[MalkThe2nd]

Wow, this could very well be our last day.

Lovers are typically a pair of players that know who each other are. Sometimes they are allowed to communicate outside of the game. What strikes me as odd is that Bara was an "innocent civilian lover" while Stalker was just an "innocent lover". Not sure if the "civilian" denotes Bara was some kind of leader of the pair, or if there were 2 different pairs.

Like Xarboth said, it seems to me that Smurf was the mafia kill. The fact that Splicer was a Callidus Assassin imo denotes a vigilante with addition powers or clauses. It may very well be possible that just targeting a townie got him killed, or like Xarboth said someone was protecting Stalker which ended in the assassin's death. I doubt it was Stalkers own ability, as mini-mason groups can be strong enough.


Someone targetted me last night which should prove my innocence to them at least.
How so? Just because the mafia got their kill anyways?

I urge any townies with any useful info or claims that could help the town to step forward. Like I said, if we don't lynch a mafia today then that's it. I love a good claim, but I have nothing to contribute and the mafia would gain by knowing what I am. :0

If I had to pick out townies right now I'd say Beeva and Pyro, mainly on gut instincts.

[Kilroy]

Well shiiiiiit. Yeah, looks like smurf was a mafia kill, Splicer was a vigilante. Maybe Stalker has a bodyguard role, where he kill anyone he is loving (Himself?). Either way, we are going to want to be extra careful this day phase. 4 town to 3 mafia, or even 5 town to 2 mafia leaves very little wiggle room.

[Stalker21]

Bwahahaha!!! Well, Splicer, looks like the mafia fooled us both. Ah well. I don't know if I'm allowed to post how my role worked or not, now that I'm dead. If Pox green lights it, I'll post it again.

[MalkThe2nd]

Stalker: Nope, no info we don't already know.

Stick to curses and chain rattling. :P

[Loner]

I think guys it's finally time that I'll show my cards.
It's perhaps a bit drastic, but considering how desperate things are, I think it is necessary.
I was given the role of inquisitorial henchman and I'm allowed to follow one person every night to see who they visit.
Last night I followed Kilroy and well he went to PapaSmurf, which later that night had died.

I didn't said this any earlier was because I wasn't sure if it was safe to do so. But it seems desperate times call for desperate measures.

The night before that one I decided to follow PapaSmurf and he spent the night sleeping peacefully.

Vote: Kilroy

[Doohicky]

I think guys it's finally time that I'll show my cards.
It's perhaps a bit drastic, but considering how desperate things are, I think it is necessary.
I was given the role of inquisitorial henchman and I'm allowed to follow one person every night to see who they visit.
Last night I followed Kilroy and well he went to PapaSmurf, which later that night had died.

I didn't said this any earlier was because I wasn't sure if it was safe to do so. But it seems desperate times call for desperate measures.

The night before that one I decided to follow PapaSmurf and he spent the night sleeping peacefully.

Vote: Kilroy

You have the same role as me but a different name. I do the exact same thing but am a feral hunter.

I think this is good as there should be a way we can corraborate each other. If we are lucky Pox's pm's to us will be similar.

I am not voting yet though until we can sort this out for sure. No point trying to check through night watching as you can be sure one of us would die to prevent it.
best part is that I had already revealed my role before you posted this to someone in a pm.

[MalkThe2nd]

Two followers... interesting.

The real question is, is it probable for the town to have two of that ability? In the sense that "everyone has a power" it could go either way. On the town side, it's not a very strong power. You know whether someone did something or not but that often won't help for their alignment. For mafia, it's quite powerful. It would allow them to sniff out activated roles like cop, doctor, or bodyguard for the others to kill off. I think it's likely we could have two followers, although I'm not 100% ready to write either of them off.

Now Loner makes a strong case, but his role history is something we already knew meaning it could be fabricated. It's very tempting for me to trust him on this as I already suspect Kilroy.

[Xarboth]

I definitely want to wait to hear what Kilroy says on the matter. I'm inclined to believe Loner on a hunch. Kilroy's done a couple of things that make me suspicious of him, but like Malk says, either Loner picked Smurfy because it was convenient or it's unfortunate that he did since it neither proves or disproves his claim.

There were a couple of posts on page 6 of the thread that caught my eye when Kilroy told Strassa to speak up for himself. I know it may just have been advice to a beginner, but Strassa had been speaking up pretty well before that. It just seemed like Kilroy knew something about Strassa - like he was telling him to claim his role because then he could back him up. And again, I know it could just mean that Kilroy has an investigative power and DID know Strassa was innocent, but what are the chances of 2 pro-town cops? 2 tracker/watcher types I can just about see, but not cops.

However, this could all be paranoia. Like I said, we need to hear from Kilroy himself.

[Doohicky]

Yeah we need to hear more. I still have heard nothing about who role blocked me....

[Beeva]

Yeah we need to hear more. I still have heard nothing about who role blocked me....

Possibly a mafia power then? Either they got lucky or they knew your role?

I don't know about roles and whatnot. I have my gut feelings but little else to go on. Need to hear what Kilroy has to say. I've never suspected Loner before but I've certainly had doubts about Kilroy.

[Kilroy]

Alright. I'll tell you this much, Loner is straight up, no contest lying. I'm a ratling, and during three night phases, I can choose to hide, which essentially makes me all actions against me not work, unless I'm roleblocked. I chose to hide last night, so he shouldn't have been able to find anything out about me, let alone find me going to smurf. Not only that but Pox said that everyone would have a different role to make things interesting.

Vote: Loner

[Doohicky]

Alright. I'll tell you this much, Loner is straight up, no contest lying. I'm a ratling, and during three night phases, I can choose to hide, which essentially makes me all actions against me not work, unless I'm roleblocked. I chose to hide last night, so he shouldn't have been able to find anything out about me, let alone find me going to smurf. Not only that but Pox said that everyone would have a different role to make things interesting.

Vote: Loner

This is why I didn't vote straight away.
I am still waiting for a reply from loner on corroborating that we have the same role.

Obviously one of you is lying. Which is it?

This could have ben a loner gamble to get a quick lynch and then night kill for mafia win.

[Xarboth]

Any chance Loner and Doohicky could post up their PMs?

[Beeva]

This is why I didn't vote straight away.
I am still waiting for a reply from loner on corroborating that we have the same role.

Obviously one of you is lying. Which is it?

This could have ben a loner gamble to get a quick lynch and then night kill for mafia win.

And its also why I'm not ruling out the possibility you're in on it! ;) I suspect everyone y'see!

[Kilroy]

Well obviously if you had the same night action, you'd have the same name. "Inquisitorial storm trooper" sounds made up, considering the game's setting. I'm more inclined to believe that "Feral hunter" has that role. Even then, it seems unlikely that Pox would make two pro-town characters with the same role, especially since we haven't seen either a doctor or a roleblocker yet.

[Kilroy]

And its also why I'm not ruling out the possibility you're in on it! ;) I suspect everyone y'see!

This, yo. Though I feel as if Doohicky has a better claim to innocence then Loner.

[Loner]

My PM:


"You are a henchmen for a powerful Inquisitor providing valuable information for the Inquisition about Heretics and traitors. Each night you will be able to PM me the name of someone you want to watch. You will be told who that person visited during the night."

[Doohicky]

You are a feral worlder, brought up in the wild you are an expert tracker and have a natural distrust of people. You may each night PM me a name of a person you wish to track. You will receive a PM the following morning telling you who that person targetted (not what they did)

Mine.

There it's also the bit about how you are allied which I deliberately left out.
That is the one but I think pox will have kept the same for all.

I just can't decide who is telling the truth.
I want to believe loner as something has not been sitting right about kilroy, but just a feeling is not enough to make me vote.

I can also see why I would be suspected as much as loner.

[Xarboth]

Though I feel as if Doohicky has a better claim to innocence then Loner.

To be fair, that doesn't add anything for the rest of us. If you're mafia then the only option left open to you after such a strong black-and-white claim like Loner's is for you to get him lynched instead, so you're obviously going to vote on Loner rather than Doohicky. If you're town, and you're the only one who can know for absolutely sure that you are, then you know for sure that Loner's mafia. But none of the rest of us can know either way.

Not saying that I particularly suspect you over Loner or vice versa. I have no idea what I think yet.

Also, I don't see how Inquisitorial Henchman is particularly harder to believe as a role than Calidus Assassin, which we've had in the game (Shadowsplicer)?

[Kilroy]

While everyone else is posting, here is mine.

You are a Ratling a small hairy abhuman that serves as the colony cook.

You may hide up to three times in the game during the night. When hidden you are immune to any and all effects during the night (including death) unless you are role-blocked.

Anyways, an assassin might get sent to kill the members of a cult in a stealthy way. In previous games, Pox has used a temple assassin too. It's been about 4 or 5 years so I can't remember which one it was, but I think it was Callidus too. Why would a stormtrooper be here? A stormtrooper is not used for creeping around and watching people but rather for assaults, or as bodyguards for inquisitors. If someone decides that they are an inquisitor after this post, I'm immediately gonna have to call bullshit on that. Anyways, it makes sense for a feral tracker to be following people around, but if an inquisitor needed someone doing that they would have an adept or something significantly less obvious then a stormtrooper following people around.

[Xarboth]

Hmm. I maybe don't know enough about fluff or running/designing a game of mafia to fully appreciate that. I assumed Plexius VII was just made up by Pox and that you would just pick rolenames concentrating more on matching the role description than sticking strictly to the fluff - as long as there's not an obvious clash, anyway.

[Kilroy]

You mean obvious clash like having an inquisitorial storm trooper as something that is neither a vigilante, bodyguard or role blocking role?

[Xarboth]

But he's not claimed 'storm trooper' - he's just said henchman, which to me could just mean any kind of servant - someone sent, as loner's roleclaim says, to "provide information about heretics and traitors". I don't think it's an obvious clash. It's not totally unfeasible.

I'm not necessarily saying I believe him, but I think you're maybe focusing on the wrong thing.

[Kilroy]

Oops. Well now I feel stupid. At any rate his information is incorrect. Anyways, if I'm guilty, why would I defend Stalker or Strassa so fervently. Both were pro-town. If I was mafia, I would have voted for Strassa, like Loner did.

[MalkThe2nd]

I'm not seeing the part he claimed himself a stormtrooper... mearly a henchmen which could be just about anything.


Well obviously if you had the same night action, you'd have the same name.

But we can already see that Bara and Stalker were both Lovers and pro-town but with slightly different titles. Since nobody has come forward claiming to be paired to them, I'm left believing they were in the same mini-mason group.

[Pox]

two quick things guys:

a) Pyro has left the game due to time issues and Drakon has been ressurected with Pyro's role and will be re-joining the game (I chose Drakon purely because he was the first person to die.)

b) have corrected in the 1st post the innocent civilian lover mistake, so they are both the same.

carry on.

[MalkThe2nd]

Look at that there's another page...

Ninja'd by Xarboth!

[MalkThe2nd]

Now ninja'd by pox, removing both things I said! *grumble*

Well now that the lovers are the same... I find myself putting less trust in 2 town followers. There's got to be a reason they are not the same title and it's likely that one of them is mafia. This is kinda tough. Loner pretty much laid out exactly the thing I wanted to hear, but that makes me feel like I'm just being baited.

On just the titles alone, henchmen sounds much more good-aligned than feral hunter. Add Kilroy's claim of ratling and it almost makes sense that both of them could be good. Now the real question is, how do we define immune? A tracker technically doesn't effect you at all, usually you don't even know it happened. I think it could be possible that "night immunity" wouldn't stop a track. But, hiders as I understand them are very tough to use roles. Typically, if you hide behind someone that dies, you die as well. On that front, I think Kilroy targeting Smurf was more likely a kill than a hide.

Quite a pickle... not sure where I want to go yet.

[Kilroy]

My role doesn't define as hiding "behind" someone, just as hiding. Loner is the mafia, etc, etc...

[DrakonTheNightLord]

7 of us left. No mafia lynched at all. We're in a bad place alright.

Going in weapons hot and

Vote: Beeva

I think the mafia are just lying low and let us talk each other to death via lynch, so I'm voting for one of the players who haven't posted much and we'll see what we shall see.

[DrakonTheNightLord]

7 of us left. No mafia lynched at all. We're in a bad place alright.

Going in weapons hot and

Vote: Beeva

I think the mafia are just lying low and let us talk each other to death via lynch, so I'm voting for one of the players who haven't posted much and we'll see what we shall see.

[Loner]

Hey guys,

Because of some small personal problems that appeared, I won't be able to post untill sunday.
Sorry for the inconveniences this might have caused.

My vote against Kilroy still stands as I know what I saw.

[Beeva]

7 of us left. No mafia lynched at all. We're in a bad place alright.

Going in weapons hot and

Vote: Beeva

Vote still only counts once!

Look, there's no real point in me posting posts that just say "I don't know". Cos I don't. It's one persons word here against another's and I'm still waiting for that one little factoid that swings it one way or the other. Besides, I was at a football match last night and wasn't home til late.

What does astound me somewhat though is how PyroTheNightLord, or whatever it is we're calling you these days, when given a choice where we know one of two people is definitely (we think) a mafia... and he votes for me...

So, are you trying to rush some kind of decision? Are you trying to distract away from Loner or Kilroy and you're trying to cover a plan that's not quite going the way you planned?

I'm resisting the urge to revenge vote right now but seriously, I can't see why you would try and put attention on someone else right now?

Of Loner and Kilroy I'm still coming down on the side of Kilroy being mafia at the minute. There is little to go on but gut feeling...

I think the mafia are just lying low and let us talk each other to death via lynch, so I'm voting for one of the players who haven't posted much and we'll see what we shall see.
.

[Beeva]

Ok, really fucked up that post... Here's how it should have read:


7 of us left. No mafia lynched at all. We're in a bad place alright.

Going in weapons hot and

Vote: Beeva

I think the mafia are just lying low and let us talk each other to death via lynch, so I'm voting for one of the players who haven't posted much and we'll see what we shall see.

Vote still only counts once!

Look, there's no real point in me posting posts that just say "I don't know". Cos I don't. It's one persons word here against another's and I'm still waiting for that one little factoid that swings it one way or the other. Besides, I was at a football match last night and wasn't home til late.

What does astound me somewhat though is how PyroTheNightLord, or whatever it is we're calling you these days, when given a choice where we know one of two people is definitely (we think) a mafia... and he votes for me...

So, are you trying to rush some kind of decision? Are you trying to distract away from Loner or Kilroy and you're trying to cover a plan that's not quite going the way you planned?

I'm resisting the urge to revenge vote right now but seriously, I can't see why you would try and put attention on someone else right now?

Of Loner and Kilroy I'm still coming down on the side of Kilroy being mafia at the minute. There is little to go on but gut feeling...

[DrakonTheNightLord]

I don't think it's either of them. They've role claimed, and their description leaves me satisfied. In my experience playing Mafia, the bad guys tend to be a) The ones posting walls of text in order to make them look like they're really for the town and b) doesn't really post much else except the 'yeahs and uh-huhs'.

One who fits a) would be Kilroy but like he said, he's been defending Strassa and Stalker for quite a bit. Of course this could be an elaborate plan on his part >_< (In which case, I hate you Kilroy) The other one who fits a) would be Malk.

b) is you, Beeva. I wouldn't say I'm rushing a decision.. you could vote for me and then we could sit on our hands and wait the day out, but I'm just voting to state clearly my stand, which says that you are mafia.

For me, the case of the henchman and feral hunter is closed. I don't see a problem with their role claims. We're done there.

For all its woth.. I'll throw this in. I am a servitor. My job is, word for word - 'to assist a chosen player every night phase'. I don't know what this actually means... so Pox, tell me via PM!

[Beeva]

Ok, so you're satisfied that we have two people with the same kind of role. I can accept that much, but maybe because you've just joined you've missed this: Loner has accused Kilroy of visiting Smurfy last night, Kilroy is outing Loner as a liar and a mafia. That doesn't really worry you at all? What are your thoughts on that?

For the record I don't really think I've been keeping quiet and not posting my opinion. I think I've consistently done that throughout the game. Our current dilema has me stumped a little I will admit.

My problem is now that I thought I had Pyro sussed. He was technically lurking but we knew why. Trouble is, Pyro didn't exactly voice any real opinions either. He'd potentially be a prime suspect for me if I didn't know his circumstances. Now we have you playing his role and coming all guns blazing at me when the timing is somewhat suspect to be honest.

[Xarboth]

Drakon, are you serious? That's not remotely helpful. The reason we're trying to decide between Loner and Kilroy is not just that they've all made roleclaims. Loner's claimed that he followed/tracked/whatever Kilroy last night, and he says Kilroy went to Smurfy, who was (we've concluded) mafia-killed. However, Kilroy's come straight out and flatly denied everything.

So either Loner's mafia and has made a last minute attempt to make us kill Kilroy (which would be a very risky move if he were mafia, but you never know. Plus there's the 'noob' factor - no offense Loner). Either Loner's mafia and is taking a significant gamble, or he's telling the truth.

If Loner's telling the truth, then Kilroy visited Smurfy at the same time he was mafia-killed. I'm very skeptical as to whether that could be a coincidence.

If Loner's telling the truth, Kilroy's mafia. If Kilroy's telling the truth, Loner's mafia. It's as simple as that. If we're right, and there are still 3 mafia and 4 pro-town, then we need all of us together voting the same way. Voting Beeva on a simple hunch isn't going to help us - he may be mafia and he may not, we have absolutely no evidence. However, we do have pretty much conclusive evidence that one of either Loner or Kilroy is mafia.

[Beeva]

^ This is the only reason I havn't voted Drakon.

[Xarboth]

Ok, the more I read through the thread, the more I'm swinging towards trusting Kilroy. His defense is pretty solid imo, and with the practically identical role it does seem that Loner's claim is also bringing Doohicky into question, and I've not had reason to suspect Doohicky at all thus far.

It seems to me that the implications are that either Loner's mafia trying to get Kilroy killed quickly (which isn't working anyway) or Kilroy and Doohicky are in on it together and Loner's being framed very, very well.

I'm going to jump off the fence and...

Vote: Loner

[DrakonTheNightLord]

Oh. Oh.

Well, sorry guys. My tab was opened at the previous page and I read the page starting with Loner's role-claim. I thought we were bickering about how varied everyone's PM was >_<

Seeing that Loner lied... I will

Unvote: Beeva
Vote: Loner

If Loner turned out to be pro-town... then damn you Kilroy.

[DrakonTheNightLord]

Valid! I meant valid, not varied, dammit >_<

[Doohicky]

I am not sure if I should vote loner or not here.

If I am wrong we are beat.

Kilroy and loner. There is a way to decide I think.

Tell us the last line of your role pm. The bit Where it says you are with or against the town.
That bit I would imagine will be the same for all who are for the town.

[Pox]

Current vote count:

Lonor 2 votes
Kilroy 1 vote

4 votes needed for majority.

[Beeva]

Forgive me, oh great putrid and oozing one, but shouldn't that be Loner on 3 and Kilroy on 1?

[Pox]

Forgive me, oh great putrid and oozing one, but shouldn't that be Loner on 3 and Kilroy on 1?

ah yes indeed missed Kilroy's vote earlier in the "day"

Current vote count:

Lonor 3 votes
Kilroy 1 vote

4 votes needed for majority.

[Beeva]

Ok, will put Drakon's early voting down to a bit of a missunderstanding. However I don't really like to voice my opinion on things until I'm certain that I've worked things out but maybe that's not the right tactic here.

Something has been bugging me, this 'gut feeling' and I think it comes down to this: Looking at the game objectively from Day 1, there is a pattern of a sort: Drakon1 dies on day one by accident it appears, Bara is Mafia killed possibly because at that early stage he was considered to be an experienced player and therefore a threat. There seems to be little other logic for it. Next up Strassa is lynched for generally being a bit inexperienced and easily bandwagoned. Night time Smurfy is mafia killed and Stalker and Splice somehow kill each other. There's a strong theme of experienced players getting killed off and people and votes being manipulated to mafia advantage during the day (to the point where Stalker and Splicer were convinced each other were mafia and used night powers to kill each other). This is why I strongly suspect an experienced hand (or probably hands) in the mafia. As such I don't feel at all comfortable voting Loner.

Coming out and saying what Loner has said seems an incredibly risky mafia plot considering it really comes down to one persons word vs another, particularly where that person is bound to shed doubt on his claim by claiming the same or similar power to someone that has already declared it. Maybe that is down to inexperience on Loners part but I'm sensing that the mafia here are a bit more cunning than that.

Vote: Kilroy

I may be wrong but it's all I've got...

[Loner]

Oh. Oh.

Well, sorry guys. My tab was opened at the previous page and I read the page starting with Loner's role-claim. I thought we were bickering about how varied everyone's PM was >_<

Seeing that Loner lied... I will

Unvote: Beeva
Vote: Loner

If Loner turned out to be pro-town... then damn you Kilroy.

Just curious, but where did you read the part that said: "Loner lied."
Only Kilroy (who visited Smurfy before he died) says that I'm not speaking the truth.

As for all of you: I would appriciate it if you could stall this game for 3 days or so, however if you guys insist on it then feel free to go ahead. :)
I cannot defend myself and I believe that some mafia would be really glad to use that oppurtunity.

[MalkThe2nd]

Beeva, I like the way you're thinking. Note, as soon as Loner says he is going inactive for a couple days the pressure on him increases. I think the town would be a it more leery at this point (I hope) and at least talk a bit more before putting Loner that close to lynch.

I've had the hiding role twice, and both times I died because I did exactly what Kilroy claims to have done.

Vote: Kilroy

At this point I'm pretty much praying Loner wasn't fed a well-tailored lie by his peers. If Doohicky were mafia and loner was town we've lost already... so I put it in his hands.

[Kilroy]

You guys say its a risky ploy for the mafia, but not really. If one townsperson joins the lynch against me they win the game. Seems easier to rush the vote than not to, at this point.

[Xarboth]

Unvote: Loner
Vote: Kilroy

[Kilroy]

I fucking knew you were mafia. :/ Get your shit together pro-town players.

[Xarboth]

;)

[Kilroy]

|:C ARRRRRRRGHHHH

[Pox]

vote count itching close:

Kilroy 3 votes
Loner 3 votes

wonder which way doohickey will go?

[Kilroy]

It's 4-3 Pox. I'm dead and the mafia just won.
Loner, Xarboth, Beeva and Malk all voted my way.

[Xarboth]

I make it 4 votes on Kilroy and 2 on Loner now? Don't know if Pox mis-counted, or if I just ninja'd his post?

[Pox]

Whilst the indecisive doohickey looks around like a rather confused and lost puppy the crowd whipped into another frenzy pounch upon Kilroy - probably because he is small, and only a little ratling so easy to beat up (part of the problem of being T2) with no-where to hide he is lynched while the mafia now just get cocky! seeing the end is nigh.

Kilroy : Ratling (hideing role/pro-town/)

after looking at the numbers can't see the towns folk winning this one - as after one more night kill they will be the minority.

Going to have to hand it to the mafia - but those townsfolk just could not get their act together - hardly anyone even looked at voting patterns!

[Kilroy]

*sigh*
*facepalm*

[Xarboth]

Is it night yet? Or game over?

[Doohicky]

Why did no one listen to me and wait for the final part of role claim?

Ah well

[Pox]

game over.

The mafia being of course:

Xarboth
LONER
and Beeva!

[Beeva]

Ah man that was close there! For a while I thought we were going to have to rely on plan B!

[Xarboth]

I didn't expect Kilroy to get lynched. I was kind of counting on Loner dying because his power was to take down the last person to vote with him if he was lynched. That would have left it 3-2 to town, with a mafia night kill, and a stalemate vote with mafia still having a night-kill.

Out of interest, what would have happened with the 2v2 vote? Would it just have been called a mafia victory with the existence of a mafia night kill? Or would it have been called a draw?

[Kilroy]

Because I was scared of Loner copying it and that would get nothign accomplished.

[Kilroy]

Really? Malk wasn't in on it. He might as well have been. Ugh... IF PEOPLE JUST DID WHAT I TOLD THEM TO DO.

[Pox]

the odds of the mafia getting a night kill where slim with Kilroy able to sneak away and Malc being bulletproof (he would have also been immune to loners exploding) thus if he had voted loner the town would have been in an ok posistion actually.

[Kilroy]

ANYWAYS, definite props to Xarboth, for being a cruel silver tongued bastard.

[Xarboth]

It was the Stalker:Shadowsplicer thing that did it, to be honest. We got very lucky with that. Plus Drakon's first death - losing a sane cop first day was a big blow to the town.

Also, apologies to Bara for the early death, and to Strassa for getting him lynched. It wasn't my intention until you started pressing things (although I still don't think you have any evidence against me). No hard feelings?

[Pox]

most the towns folk who got lynched where pitiful when it came to defending themselves it was almost like they wanted to die! though losing a sane cop on the first lynch was severaly bad news for the town! (and that's why I always abstain on the first day in a game when everyone has a role!)

[Kilroy]

So what were the mafia roles anyways?

Other than that I am pushing my own game. If you haven't already joined, do so immediately! http://www.40kforums.com/vb/showthread.php/33977-Cult-Bunker-Party-Mafia/page2

[Beeva]

I think to be fair we'd have still got the kill with Xarboths roleblock ability. I think we'd have combined that with a kill. Malk not dieing would have been a huge blow though!

And for the record, I was the other watcher :)

[Xarboth]

Malk being bulletproof would certainly have ruined plan B if he'd voted Loner then. Wow. That was certainly closer than I thought. I figured someone had an anti-nightkill power somewhere - I think Malk at one point said that he was very important for the town, and assumed he might have been hinting at something like that, so I'd have avoided nightkilling him.

Also, at one point during this game, I noticed there were 24 people viewing the thread. Is that normal for a 12 player game of mafia???

[Xarboth]

Hey Pox, any chance you could post up all the role PMs and who did what as night actions?

[Strassa]

ITS all good i just KNEW IT ahhh that makes me so upset i was so close but i couldn't get anybody on my side

[Kilroy]

ITS all good i just KNEW IT ahhh that makes me so upset i was so close but i couldn't get anybody on my side

I know exactly how you feel. :/
Its okay buddy. We did our very best.

[Beeva]

I'm just amused that we won the game by voting Kilroy. I know feel in on the joke :D

Vote: Kilroy (Just to make sure he's dead)

[Kilroy]

*Dies some more*

Forum inside jokes 4 lyphe. I wish Moz was around so we could discuss SLAMMIN LLAMAS

[MalkThe2nd]

Meh, like Pox said town was doing a bad job of defending itself.

Kilroy your role was the final draw for me. I've never heard of a hider that doesn't die... and I don't see the point of it seeing that they were able to track you anyways. Basically a non-role.

Hell, I was thinking Drakon was mafia working with Xarboth just because he said this...


a) The ones posting walls of text in order to make them look like they're really for the town... The other one who fits a) would be Malk.
When it's obvious that Xarboth has much longer posts than I.

Plus Kilroy, you sounded quite slippery when you said this

My role doesn't define as hiding "behind" someone, just as hiding. Loner is the mafia, etc, etc...

Sounds like you're double-talking here to me. Hiding with, behind, whatever same thing.

[Kilroy]

Hey, I didn't make the character role. Pox did. Honestly, I think you were trying to read to deep into what I was writing. Essentially by that point I was kind of frustrated that people hadn't immediately jumped to lynch Loner.

[MalkThe2nd]

Honestly, I think you were trying to read to deep into what I was writing.

Pretty much. I thought I had perhaps caught you in a slip-up. Ah well, the rust is off. Give me a freakin cult role plox. Playing as town sux I always end up with a sweet power I waste or flat out didn't need. :(

Edit: Please don't lynch me D1 gais I didn't mean it! lol

[DrakonTheNightLord]

I will have my revenge... IN THE NEXT GAME!!

Also wtf is wrong with me... I read up to page 11 and sent Pox a night action PM... then realised game was over. Fuck this...

[Xarboth]

We couldn't track Kilroy at all, that was all a big fat lie. The final day was a plan that we thought couldn't fail because of Loner's power (if he's lynched, the last person to vote for him dies too). We figured if he said what he said about anyone (sorry that we picked you Kilroy - that was pretty much at random) they'd come straight back and vote Loner, and it would be obvious that one of them was mafia. If they believed Loner we'd make it 3-3 with a night kill; but if they didn't believe him, we'd make it 3-2 with a night-kill so 2-2 at the start of next day.

However, it turns out Malk wouldn't have died because he was bulletproof so it'd have been 4-2 and we'd have struggled from there, I think. Good job Malk voted Kilroy really...;)

[MalkThe2nd]

That's my rust showing. Shortly after I posted that vote, on my way to work, I realized how dumb that vote was. Loner had been sitting at 3 votes for a bit and if he was town then someone would have tossed on that final vote before I even posted. Then my dumbass comes along and sets up an easy vote change.

I was paying too much attention to the convo and not enough attention to the voting trend.

I miss Moz, he would have slapped some sense into us... even if he usually gets me lynched.

[Xarboth]

Yeah, that's why I was really concerned when Drakon voted Beeva. If Beeva had been on one vote for a long time without anyone else jumping on it, someone would have worked out he was mafia otherwise the mafia would have jumped on him. That's why Beeva and I were so quick to jump on Drakon so strongly.

[DrakonTheNightLord]

To be fair.. . I DID misunderstand the whole thing... I would have voted Loner anyway if I actually read the thread >_<

[Loner]

Victory! \o/

I must say that I actually expected to have been blown to bits or torn apart when I came back.
(Although I wot deny it that I'm glad to have lived through to see the victory. :P)

As for Pox, I enjoyed this game a lot and I want to thank you for it.
When you're starting a new one, feel free to pm me about it! :D

[DrakonTheNightLord]

experienced players getting killed off


Drakon1 dies

I'm sorry but I just had to laugh at this one :')

[Beeva]

Whaaaa???

[DrakonTheNightLord]

Implying that I was an experienced, if not the most experienced player in the game did it for me.

I've played a few games but am still rubbish though XD

[Beeva]

Ah, well. Experienced doesn't mean good ;) I was trying to make people chose Kilroy over Loner remember! And it worked :D