[Normal Mafia 16] Back to Basics (Game Over)

[Subzero]

The first thing you feel is the pain. A dull, pounding sensation in the back of your head that makes you wish you hadn't woken up.

The second thing you feel is confusion. What just happened? Did someone attack you? Where are you? It certainly doesn't feel like your home – through the pain the faint thrum of industrial machinery can be heard, and the air is cold and damp.

The third thing you feel is fear, as your eyes open only to see blurry, indistinct shadows, moving and groaning as if they to have woken up, around you in a dark room. You have no idea who these people are but they seem to be in exactly the same predicament as you.

As soon as you begin to properly awake from your half-conscious, incoherent thoughts, harsh white light bathes you from above. Without any rhyme or reason other lights begin to activate around the room and you receive your first view of your prison; a dungeon-like room built from now-weathered stone bricks. You and your fellow prisoners are seated in a circle around a smooth, metal, ring-shaped table, sitting on monolithic chairs of the same metal which seem to have been built with only one of two purposes in mind – maximum functionality or maximum discomfort. A single bright light shines directly down on each one of you and a much larger light glowing above the table. By your first count there must be at least half a dozen people here...ten...twelve, thirteen, fourteen...including yourself, fifteen people are trapped here. In front of each of you lies a thin placard, blank on the side facing you. You reach to pick it up -

- and you are interrupted by a four-sided tannoy system dropping from the ceiling, hanging above the table by an arrangement of metal arms and wires. This attracts the attention of everyone in the room – everyone seems to be caught off-guard by the sudden and noisy intrusion.

For a moment it seems to do nothing but hang there and the eyes of some of the prisoners drift, but then it swiftly crackles into life and starts speaking...

Here's the player list – it's at the top of the post for convenience:

Alive

2) Tarion'Maseth

4) the cow (replacing Aikanaro)



8) scythes



12) Baragash


15) p3990013

Dead
3) Magnus777z – Innocent – injected with hydrofluoric acid in night 0, later injected with calcium gluconate on day 1
?) bailey0156 - injected with hydrofluoric acid on day 1
14) ']['Ritha][ - Innocent – injected with natural killer cells on day 1
1) Kilroy – Innocent – disappeared in night 1
9) DeathForce – Innocent – suffered a simulation of Tarantula Hawk stings on day 2
13) Grotfang – Innocent – asphyxiated due to thrombosis in night 2
5) Mozric – Mafia – lacerated by magnetic barbs on day 3
7) Zawicki – Innocent – suffered a simulation of... some form of stings in night 3
10) Doohicky – Innocent – injected and sprayed with concentrated hydrazine on day 4
6) shotcoder – Innocent – had his brain liquefied by ultrasonic weaponry on day 5
?) Aikanaro – disappeared on day 5
?) the cow – appeared on day 5
11) Magnus777z (replacing bailey0156) – Innocent – severely burned by alpha-radioactive particles in night 5

Substitutes
None.

So, without further ado, allow me to explain the premise of this game:

There are no roles other than 12 standard Innocents and 3 standard Mafiosi.

Simple, right? Everything's set out, it's all rather plain really – just basic roles. Seems like a newbie game, except even those have non-standard roles.

Right?




WRONG, FOOLS!

THIS IS NO MERE CHILDREN'S GAME.

IT'S GOING TO SEPARATE THE MEN FROM THE BOYS.

AND THE GODS FROM THE MEN!
And from there divide into sub-categories according to mythological status, prevalence of worship and relevance to modern socio-politics.

And just how will this game perform this feat? It's quite simple; there aren't any special roles to rely on whatsoever. No Cops to give absolute results, no Doctors to give the town a brief reprieve from the killings. No Jesters and Lynchers to make people worried about lynching. No special Mafia roles to inhibit the town. This is Mafia reduced to its purest, simplest form. An uninformed majority versus an informed minority duking it out through discussion, deceit, psychological warfare and a healthy dose of democratic lynching.

With that said, I'll move on to explaining the rules...

”...Welcome, everyone. I trust you are all awake and I apologise for any discomfort you may be feeling”.

The dry formality of the voice, as if the person speaking was reading from a script, betrays their apathy towards you all.

“As of last night you became the honoured guests of your benevolent host. However, in return for their hospitality they require that you entertain them”.

Other prisoners around you begin to mumble to each other – comparing the fragments of memories they have from the night before – but others remain half-awake and transfixed by the tannoy. Nobody seems to know what to make of the situation and nobody is conscious enough to reply to the machine.

“All they wish for you to do is take part in a simple game. It may take some time, but you are free to leave your seats. The game you will be playing is...Mafia”.

One or two of the prisoners perk up at the mention of the word, but most are just confused by it, having no idea of what it means or what sort of game it could be, given its association with brutal crime families. However, those who do understand shift and fidget uncomfortably at the mention of it. What could this 'host' possibly want people to do during a game of Mafia? Why was it necessary to kidnap people for the purpose of finding players for the game? The questions do nothing but provoke fear in you.

“The rules are quite easy to learn, I am sure you will be pleased to hear...”

The standard game structure of Mafia applies in this game – day phases, night phases, voting, lynching etc.. For anybody unfamiliar with the rules, check out the 'newbie's guide to Mafia' link in my sig. Specific game conduct rules are as follows:

1) Don't quote game-related PMs from me in the topic. However, this isn't exceptionally relevant in this game due to the roles so there won't be any real punishment for breaking it, although I still expect you to follow it on the basis that it's almost impossible to break in this game unless you're an idiot Mafioso who's trying to get lynched.

2) Only post in the topic during the day phase. The day phase begins after I post the night phase death scene and ends once the lynching vote is placed. Once you die you're allowed to post once in the day phase after your death to lament your demise, curse your killers and/or cheer your faction on. Given the nature of this game's roles this isn't as relevant as in other games so there's no real punishment, although I expect you to follow it because you could still unfairly talk about suspicions during the night phase.

3) Don't communicate outside of the topic with other players about the game unless your role PM specifically allows you to. If I'm informed of anyone breaking this rule I'll look for a replacement or, if there isn't an available replacement, mod-kill them.

4) Post at least once every 48 hours. If you miss this deadline I'll send you a PM reminder and you'll have another 48 hours to post. If you don't post in this second time limit I'll replace you or, if no replacement is available, modkill you. Additionally, if the discussion during a day phase lags I may add a deadline for that day phase only – by the day of the deadline whoever has the most votes will be lynched regardless of whether they have a majority of votes. If two or more people have the same number of votes then, once the deadline is reached, the first one to have more votes than the other(s) will be lynched.

”...With that said, I will now explain the purpose of the placards in front of you. The underside of each one is inscribed with either the word 'Innocent' or the word 'Mafia'. There are fifteen of you in total – twelve of you possess 'Innocent' placards and the remaining three possess 'Mafia' placards. These basic descriptions are for your convenience, particularly for those who have only just been introduced to it”.

Your hand, which has not yet moved from the placard in front of you, stretches its fingers out further around it. You prepare to flip it over but the tannoy interrupts you before you can: “naturally, you will want to avoid displaying your identity to the other players, particularly as you will have to carry the placard with you at all times”.

“The second purpose the placard serves is to allow you to explain your night action to your benevolent host so that the appropriate...consequences will occur during the 'night'. The stylus and touchscreen on the opposite side of the placard can be used to write 'sleep' if you will not perform a night action, or 'kill' followed by your target if you are the Mafiosi performing the murder. This is all the information required of you”.

With that, your hand clutches the edge of your placard as you prepare to turn it over...

So, here are the two role PMs – these are standard for everyone:


You turn over your placard with bated breath – it is inscribed with the word 'Innocent'. As such, you have no night action and may not communicate outside of the topic, although you do have the very important ability to vote during the day phase. You win when all four Mafiosi are dead and at least one Innocent is still alive.


You turn over your placard with bated breath – it is inscribed with the word 'Mafia'. The names of your two comrades are written on the touchscreen below as XXXXX and YYYYY. The three of you may communicate outside of the topic with each other during the night phase. Each night phase, one of you must write on your touchscreen (or rather, PM me) that you will kill one other living player in the game – specify which player is your target. You win when all of the Innocents are dead and at least one Mafioso is still alive, or when nothing can prevent this from happening.

Signups happen in the topic as normal.

[Kilroy]

In! Safe!

[Tarion'Maseth]

I'll give it a go. I do expect nitpicking to go insane in this game though

[Magnus777z]

I'm in

[Aikanaro]

I would like to join this game. I've played a few times before with friends and it was very interesting.

[Mozric]

In. Should be very fun.

[shotcoder]

This one looks crazy, I'm so in.

[Zawicki]

i guess i'll try this thing again. Hopefully i'll play better this time.

[scythes]

In in in in in! That's in just once, I don't want to take up 5 slots. :mrgreen:

[DeathForce]

I am in as well

[Doohicky]

Booyakasha. Big up the mafia my brothers. I is well in this one!

(I'm in)

Subzero, I am at a stag do all weekend and won't be able to post until monday.
I hope that won't be a problem.

[Subzero]

Half of the places are full. I also fixed the quote tags around the role PMs in the first post.

Doohicky, the game should begin tomorrow or Sunday but it'll begin during night 0, so regardless of your role you shouldn't miss out on anything because the actual discussion will begin sometime next week.

[scythes]

Woohoo! I'm the smiley entry! That means I auto win right? 8)

[bailey0156]

in! and the good news is i know what i am doing.

[Baragash]

In please!

[DeathForce]

Half of the places are full. I also fixed the quote tags around the role PMs in the first post.

Doohicky, the game should begin tomorrow or Sunday but it'll begin during night 0, so regardless of your role you shouldn't miss out on anything because the actual discussion will begin sometime next week.

no no that means you are the first to die :P

[Subzero]

60% full. Is it me or is the population of Mafia players dwindling?

[DeathForce]

I dont know to be honest I am new to this :P

[Kilroy]

Same problem I had.

[Grotfang]

I'm in! Been off for a bit (revising for exams :() but I'm back now! Hooray :)

[Subzero]

Okay people, we're about two thirds full and the flow of players signing up seems to have stopped - now we need to start actively recruiting people. By we, I mean you as I am far too lazy to do such a thing. The people in the Mafia census in the Mafia Discussion topic (there's a link in my sig) should be more willing to play than other people though.

[Kilroy]

Maybe you should shrink it down.

[Subzero]

Down from 20 to 13 is a massive difference though.

[Kilroy]

I mean to something like 16/15.

[bailey0156]

Yeah I think we need to shrink it. Not any more people seem botherd.

[Subzero]

I mean to something like 16/15.
Ah, I thought you were suggesting I bring it down by a third of the total players...not only would that have been a significant change, it would also have been more difficult to balance such an odd number as 13 players. However, 15 players is easier to balance.

Okay then, the roles have changed; there are now going to be 15 players, 3 of whom will be Mafiosi and 12 of whom will be regular Innocents. I'll edit this into the first post and look around for some regular Mafia players who aren't participating.

EDIT: By the way, there's currently no game on the list after mine. If anyone wants to run the next one it's up for grabs right now.

[']['Ritha][]

In if it isn't full? >.>

[Subzero]

There's one spot left now. I've PMed a regular player who's not playing already, but I don't know if he's willing to play or not yet.

[Zawicki]

lefthandedyeticould probably play, just not in the first week seeing as he has finals next week.

[Subzero]

As a matter of fact he's the person I asked. I suppose it wouldn't matter too much if he didn't play for a week because the first day phase tends to last twice as long as that at least. There would also be the first night phase which would be another 48 hours, so he probably wouldn't be missing too much.

[bailey0156]

So are we starting it yet?

[Subzero]

We need one more person, who will hopefully be yeti. If not then we'll have to find another regular Mafia player and ask them to join.

[DeathForce]

well dang this is taking forever :P

[bailey0156]

Ok i can wait.

[scythes]

You're probobly gonna have to send PM's to all the players when this starts to remind them they joined. It's been a while since sign-ups started. :roll:

[p3990013]

Can I join? Let's get the ball rolling!!!

[Subzero]

Let's get this show on the road!

Currently it's night 0 and will stay that way for 48 hours.

[Subzero]

zzzzzzzz -snores loudly-

*Kicks DeathForce*

I have to sit in this chair for 36 more hours. sheesh.

These kinds of posts during the night phase are essentially spam because they serve no purpose, so it would be best if people didn't post during the night phase (I mean, it's going to be day in only about 36 hours).

[Mozric]

As a moderator, I'll have to ask people to not post pointlessly in the night phase.

From now on I'm just going to delete all spam posts.

[Subzero]

”As it is now the first night, night 0, you must remain seated and complete your 'night action' – either 'sleep' or 'kill' – using the stylus and the tablet. Punishment will be severe for anyone who disobeys these simple rules.”

A chill runs down your spine at the mention of 'punishment'. What the hell did they mean? Just who the hell did they think they were, kidnapping people then making them play along with their bullshit games? You go along with it for now, filling out your tablet normally, but swear to yourself that when you get out of this shithole – and Christ it's definitely going to be 'when' – you're going to show these fuckers how much you appreciate their...hospitality.

In the meantime you try to sneak a sidelong glance at the tablets of the two people sitting beside you, but just like you everyone is hunched over their own to protect themselves and their choice. Well, not that it matters that much. Once this night is over you'll convince everyone that there's no point playing this game and that they can easily break out if they work together.

A buzzer sounds and the tinny voice of the tannoy returns: “In night 0 the Mafia's chosen victim was Magnus777z. As per the rules you will now be removed from the game. It is now day 1.”

Immediately, two hatches open on the sides of Magnus' chair by his arms – imperceptible before, they open to reveal some sort of compact mechanism -

- that in the space of just one second shoots out to reveal two mechanical arms, each ending in a syringe, that jab themselves into Magnus' wrists. His head jerks forwards, revealing a third needle hidden behind his head. All three begin to push a clear liquid into his body, but by this point your attention is no longer on the machines.

Magnus shudders, twitches and foams at the mouth in his chair as everyone looks on with horror. It becomes crystal clear to you in just a single second how false your bravado was, how impotent your rage. You can scarcely look at Magnus any longer as you feel yourself beginning to wretch and you turn away to protect yourself from the indignity of vomiting, but even then you can still hear the hiss of the syringes, the hum of the machinery and, worst of all, the feverish gasps of a dying man. Everything now seems...hopeless.

But that can't be right. There's no such thing as a definitely hopeless situation. There's always an alternative in the realm of possibility. As long as you have time to think, time to plan, you will be able to devise a way to escape this place. You won't be able to save everyone, but you'll bring as many with you as you can, and when you do escape you'll make whoever's keeping you trapped here suffer. Screw morality. Screw virtue. Screw honour and all those ridiculous ideas. Once you get out, you'll make them pay in the most painful way possible.

“...Your benevolent host would like me to inform the curious amongst you that the chemical used to remove Magnus777z was concentrated hydrofluoric acid, a chemical that causes severe burns, the corrosion of bones and the destruction of nerve tissues. Please do not let this fact discourage you from playing the game to your fullest potential.”

Magnus777z – Innocent – injected with hydrofluoric acid in night 0

It's now day 1. 8 votes are required to lynch someone.

[p3990013]

Let me start by sharing what I already know:

- I am innocent.
- There are three mafia members and twelve innocents (now that one innocent was killed).

If any of you have some more info, let's share :)

[Mozric]

Fantastic (if horrifying) description Subzero.

p399013: I can't really add any more information to what you've said. Of course, I'm hardly going to take your claim that you are innocent at face value -- similarly I don't expect you to believe that I'm innocent for no good reason.

Anyway, let's get started...

Random Stab the First:
Hmmm, I rolled a 9.
Vote: Deathforce

He was an innocent last game, but may not be this time! Well, to be honest, I have no reason to believe that Deathforce is any more suspicious than the rest of you, but we have to start somewhere.

Hmmm, it's a bit tricky with no cops... well, does anybody want to try to accuse me of being mafia for making a random vote? Or perhaps p is suspicious because he is claiming to be innocent?
I just hope that everybody posts, let's not let anybody get away with blatant lurking, mmk?

[Tarion'Maseth]

P - The problem is, everyone will make a similar statement. Since we can't make use of special roles, all we all know is that we're innocent and there's 3 bad guys.

As Mozric said, we need to all post, and we need to analyse the posts of everyone. We need to find flawed argumentation.

Which means that the first stab in the dark is useless, so I'm writing off Mozric's post. Again, nothing useful, as yet.

Vote: Deathforce - I figure I might as well. I'll change this before he gets lynched.

[Grotfang]

Loved the text sub!

As has been said, we can't figure anything out using logic at this stage, so subjective opinion has to lead the way!

So... two votes for Deathforce already? Albeit tenuous, suspicion builds for bandwagoning...

Vote: Tarion :P

[Doohicky]

Vote: Grotfang

I watched Derren Brown at the weekend and there was a kitten in that which a girl had to NOT kill. She failed due to the power of suggestion (Although the kitten still lived).

Anyway, you have a kitten in your Avatar, so I vote to electrocute you! :P

[p3990013]

Vote: Doohicky

Because I like voting the last poster in the thread :P

[scythes]

Wow, that was a pretty sucky way to go. Anyway, I'm going to...

VOTE: MOZRIC

...because his post was so incredibly confusing and jumped all over the place I think he's trying to confuse everyone, also because every is voting for the person above them but Mozric got missed. :mrgreen:

[Kilroy]

Vote:Tarion

No reason to put two votes on the random stab. Kind of pointless.

EDIT: Never mind actually Unvote

[DeathForce]

Wow jeez I love you two too, I can assure you I am quite innocent thank you.

Vote Tarion!

[Aikanaro]

Vote: Tarion

No real reason for the Vote, since theres no evidence of who is who quite yet. So I figured I would join the Bandwagon and go with one of the people that already has a vote.

[Subzero]

The tannoy buzzes slightly before crackling fully into life again: "Vote counts will occur periodically. The first vote count will occur now. Please politely remain silent.

DeathForce has two votes against himself - Mozric and Tarion'Maseth.
Tarion'Maseth has four votes against himself - Grotfang, Kilroy, Deathforce and Aikanaro.
Grotfang has one vote against himself - Doohicky.
Doohicky has one vote against himself - p3990013.
Mozric has one vote against himself - scythes.

Tarion'Maseth is closest to being lynched at four votes out of the necessary eight.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: shotcoder, Zawicki, bailey0156, Baragash and
']['Ritha][.

Remember that your host has organised this game for the purposes of entertainment and enjoyment, so do not be afraid to participate to your fullest."

[Baragash]

Hmmm, suspicions:

Tarion for bandwagoning

Aik for counter-bandwagoning

Moz for attempting to counter possible suspicions whilst posting on a player whose playing style is potentially abrasive enough to get them lynched

*ponders*

Vote: Mozric

(Note: got uber-exams at the moment, will be checking once in the evening rather than my usual permanent online status)

[']['Ritha][]

Vote: p3990013

-Silent point and glare-

[Zawicki]

Wow, thats a lot of voting so far. I'm going to not vote right now seeing as most of this seems pretty pointless. But, i'm suspicious of Tarion, Mozric, and Aik.

[Mozric]

Hmmm, Tarion is looking quite dodgy, for putting a second vote on Deathforce... Keeping an eye on him.
But I would be more suspicious of those of you who seem so keen for a lynch. After all, Tarion did say:

I'll change this before he gets lynched.


I'm looking at Deathforce and Aikanaro. I think that one of them may well be mafia. The question is, how can we tell?

I'm going to leave my vote on Deathforce. He seems quite defensive, more than is needed for having two votes on him that were clearly not very serious.

Still, the evidence is not conclusive, and I do hope that we don't cause a lynch just yet. I'm liking the amount of discussion we're getting though. It's good to see that everybody but Bailey has posted, and I think that everybody has voted at one point except for Zawicki.

[shotcoder]

I'm going to have to agree with Moz on this one, the past few games I've played he's been very good with his reasoning and was right a few times.....

But even though DeathForce is the most Defensive I want to

vote: Aikanaro

Because he specifically stated he wanted a lynch. Why would you want to risk lynching an innocent?

Also why is Tarion getting voted so heavily? I see no huge reasons at all.

[DeathForce]

Defensive? Did you even read what I said

1. You are a mafioso taking what I said way out of context
2. you are a moron

take your pick

[shotcoder]

Defensive? Did you even read what I said

1. You are a mafioso taking what I said way out of context
2. you are a moron

take your pick

:roll: Good job solidifying your status as a Mafia member, by clearly coming out and attacking someone because of what they viewed from your post. There were many nicer ways to put that, but you had to be a total asshat.

unvote

vote: DeathForce

[DeathForce]

just because I am an asshole doesn't make me one of the bad guys.

[Zawicki]

Vote: Mozric

He seems a bit jumpy on deathforce. I really don't see how he was being so defensive and maybe you're trying to take some heat off of tarion, who might be a fellow mafia memeber. It's early in the game and the random vote could quite easily be a coincidence. But, it also could be a subtle link for two mafioso.

[']['Ritha][]

-Glares at both Shotcoder and Deathforce. Would point to both if physically possible. Instead, continues to point at p3990013. Franticly.-

[p3990013]

Exactly why do you point at me Ritha? :?

I am only trying to help by giving all the information I can get access to :!:

[Baragash]

I have to say Ritha, your behaviour is a little confusing.....

@Sub: are you generally a bit twisted or did you watch something like the Cube/Cube Zero recently?

[Doohicky]

Okay.. People have posted and therefore it's time to take off my joke/unwarranted vote...

Unvote - Grotfang

My real vote goes to Aikanaro. Far to quick to jump on a bandwagon there. The last thing we need is a quick lynch. We need to spread the day phase out and hope for mistakes, not kill people will nilly!

Vote - Aikanaro

[Subzero]

@Sub: are you generally a bit twisted or did you watch something like the Cube/Cube Zero recently?
I am a twisted bastard, yes (also I do know of the Cube movies).

[Tarion'Maseth]

Unvote: Deathforce

Wow. I go away for a while and get massive jumping on me. Everyone who voted for me after I said I'd remove the vote shortly is suspicious for just the reasons they tried to use on me. Massive Bandwagoning.

Anyway, having seen how Deathforce is acting (Why get so worked up? I mean, honestly. Insulting players is a good way to get you lynched)


Wow jeez I love you two too, I can assure you I am quite innocent thank you.

Defensive? Did you even read what I said

1. You are a mafioso taking what I said way out of context
2. you are a moron

take your pick

Yes, that's defensive. Taking out of context? You re-acted massively to two random stabs. I had even stated that mine was going to get removed. And yet,that's a reason to say "Wow jeez". No, in fact, the random stabs nearly never get voted off. Hence random.

Frankly, saying a player is either a mafia or an idiot isn't a good way of arguing your case. Making people afraid to say you're suspicious for fear of flaming isn't exactly a clever move.


just because I am an asshole doesn't make me one of the bad guys.

It certainly doesn't predispose us to wanting to support you.

I've removed my vote, as I said I would. However, if Deathforce carries on acting the way he is at the moment, expect it to return to him.

[DeathForce]

How kind of you Tarion and if anyone wants to know why Ritha is not speaking its because he is a mime :P

[Kilroy]

Sub, I actually unvoted in the same post because I didn't want to remove what was said. Tarion only has 3 votes against him.

[Mozric]

Wow, Deathforce. Thanks for being so kind. :?

I agree with tarion to a degree.... but I don't think that this necessarily means that Deathforce is mafia. Perhaps he's mafia playing badly, but you think he'd be a bit more quiet if he was.

Hmmm, I don't have any really strong suspicions. Perhaps it's time to make a list (especially since I'm supposed to be working):
1) Kilroy -- a little bit quiet and non-committal, changed his mind, probably thoughtful innocent.
2) Tarion'Maseth -- somewhat sneaky, either mafia or just playing as per usual.
4) Aikanaro -- fairly dubious. possible mafia or foolish innocent.
5) Mozric -- me!
6) shotcoder -- ritha *glared* at shotcoder, and I'm not really sure why. His posts could be interpreted as either suspicious or just normal innocent comments. I'm unsure, but I'm thinking he's more likely to be innocent than not.
7) Zawicki -- has some interesting conspiracy theories. That could make him innocent because he's willing to stick his neck out. But he could be just trying to stir the pot. Unsure about him too.
8) scythes -- hasn't really said anything yet.
9) DeathForce -- worried mafia or innocent getting a bit emotionally involved in the game.
10) Doohicky -- seems reasonable. possible innocent
11) bailey0156 -- hasn't posted
12) Baragash -- possible innocent. said something fairly original.
13) Grotfang -- hasn't said much, but his one post was fairly reasonable. possible innocent.
14) ']['Ritha][ -- being mysteriously sub-vocal in a game with no special roles. maybe a crazy mafia, but more likely innocent.
15) p3990013 -- hasn't said anything really relevant in the three posts. Fairly dodgy.

So, the people that seem the most suspicious to me are:
Aikanaro, DeathForce and p3990013. Also (to a lesser degree) I'd look at Zawicki and just maybe Tarion and shotcoder.

And, as such, because p399013 hasn't had any attention on him:

Vote: p3990013

If bailey0156 and Scythes could post too, that'd be nice.

[scythes]

I did post once, yesterday, and voted for you Mozric because your first vote was really confusing and I thought you were trying to confuse people so they wouldn't look at you, and it was a random vote to boot.


I'm looking at Deathforce and Aikanaro. I think that one of them may well be mafia. The question is, how can we tell?
This statement came pretty early in the game and makes you look really sure about these two with very little to go, again taking eyes off of you and putting them elsewhere. Thus, my vote will be staying on you Mozric.

And Deathforce, votes against you aren't supposed to be personal, but if you keep acting like you do they will start to be personal. If you are in fact innocent you might want to calm down some, getting an innocent lynched because we just get tired of your outbursts won't help the town any.

[Mozric]

Scythes: I don't guarantee that what I say will turn out to be correct. I'm just trying to keep the discussion going by posting up my hunches and suspicions.
Apologies if I'm appearing a bit confusing. I will try to be more clear.

And, if you quoted my whole post rather than just the line about Deathforce and Aikanaro, you'd find that the reason I picked those two out was because they were the two people who seemed most keen for a lynch of Tarion. There's a difference between voting for somebody because you want to provoke some discussion from them and voting for somebody because you want to lynch them, and the latter is what Deathforce and Aikanaro seemed to be doing. (Although, admittedly, looking back at that post I didn't explain it out fully like that, but it was implied by the first two things I said.)

[']['Ritha][]

-Raises a second arm to point halfheartedly at Mozzy. Sighs. Drops arm. Shakes head. Keeps pointing at p3990013.-

[DeathForce]

I just voted for Tarion because he voted for me that was the only reason.

[Zawicki]

Ritha, may i ask what exactly you are doing, all of your posts have had some pointing motion in them, but thats it. nothing to add to the disscusion or anything. Please be more productive with your posts.

[DeathForce]

Ritha Can't talk its quite obvious :P

[Tarion'Maseth]

Ritha Can't talk its quite obvious :P
However, there are no special roles. So it's either Ritha won't talk, or Sub lied to us. I'm inclined towards the first.


if anyone wants to know why Ritha is not speaking its because he is a mime :PIf you know he's a mime, it would indicate you two have spoken outside of the game thread. That would indicate that you're the mafia, as to the best of my knowledge, they're the only ones who can do that.

[Baragash]

Unvote

Vote: Aikanaro

I am still suspicious of Moz, however, I would like to see some more input from Aik, so the vote movement is "subtle" pressure.

[p3990013]

So Mozric and Ritha are trying to get me lynched.

Unvote

Vote: Mozric

I am not voting Ritha as he might indeed be a mime...

[Subzero]

"The day's second vote count will now begin. Please politely remain silent.

Deathforce has one vote against himself - shotcoder
Tarion'Maseth has three votes against himself - Grotfang, Deathforce and Aikanaro
Mozric has three votes against himself - scythes, Zawicki and p3990013
p3990013 has two votes against himself - ']['Ritha][ and Mozric
Aikanaro has two votes against himself - Doohicky and Baragash

Tarion'Maseth and Mozric are jointly closest to being lynched with three each of the necessary eight.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Kilroy, Tarion'Maseth and bailey0156."

[Tarion'Maseth]

I am not voting Ritha as he might indeed be a mime...I don't understand that argument at all. He might be a mime? Surely you mean, he's choosing to act like a mime. He can't have the role to act like a mime, so instead, he seems to be doing it deliberately, essentially meaning he has no need for detailed discussion, or reasoning, but instead is essentially contributing nothing, other than suspicions. No reasoning behind them.

[scythes]

Adding nothing to the discussion but pointing out suspects is rather odd, almost like lurking but not quite. It seems like Ritha is trying to stay under the radar by not contributing much but still posting in the thread. I got my eye on you!

[Grotfang]

Sorry I didn't post yesterday - I was driving home from uni.

Firstly:

Unvote

My initial vote for Tarion was, obviously, only to get the ball rolling, and I don't believe we have anything concrete to go on yet.

Ritha is really annoying me. Given we have no particular roles, I can't figure out why he'd be acting so strangely... Could you please substantiate your arguments? Also, I don't see what p3 has done that would make you suspect him.

At the moment, Ritha seems most suspicious to me. If he doesn't justify his posts next time, then I will be voting for him.

[DeathForce]

So why the hell play a mime then :/ hes confusing me lol

[scythes]

He could be sowing the seeds of confusion so people don't know who to vote for. When a day starts to get too long often the GM will end it with the person with the most votes dead or less votes needed. In that circumstance a single vote could go a long way.

Right now I'm looking at Ritha and Mozric, but I'm still suspicious of everyone else not named Scythes! :mrgreen:

[Kilroy]

Vote: Bailey Trying to see if he'll start posting if he is voted for.

My suspisions are great and vast but right now I'm thinking Mozric. I won't vote for him until I see something weird from him though.

[Aikanaro]

Unvote

I unvoted for Tarion, since I don't currently suspect him to be mafia. After reading the posts thus far theres only a few people that I suspect to be mafia, and they are Ritha, Scythes and Bailey. But I can't really make an argument against Ritha or bailey considering I haven't actually read anything other than funny hand movements. The reason I think Scythes might be mafia is because of how he singled out Mozric, doing what Mozric did by suspecting Deathforce and I as mafia members and affectively keeping any eyes that might have ever suspected him of ever being mafia onto someone who has been suspected multiple times.

Theres my pocket full of change. So my vote is to no-one as of yet.

[Mozric]

Aikanaro: I do agree that scythes has gotten away with posting a few times but not saying too much, and ritha has similarly been a little bit silly... but I don't totally buy what you're saying.

Tarion's unnecessary vote for Deathforce was pretty dubious and strange, but I don't think that there was nearly enough evidence to try for a lynch of him. Grotfang was the first to put a vote on Tarion, nothing wrong with putting one vote on somebody. Kilroy's second vote was to put a bit more pressure on Tarion, and he swiftly unvoted -- doesn't look like mafia. But, Deathforce and Aikanaro seemed to want to push the balance from pressure on Tarion towards a lynch. So I stand by my hunch that one or both of them could be mafia.

But, still, I don't think there have been any major slip-ups yet.

At the moment I'm most wary of those who seem to be playing quietly and conservatively. It's a common mafia tactic to go with the flow and try to manipulate it subtly. So I'm looking at scythes, shotcoder and p399013.
Ritha also should stop being a mime. Seriously. Please?

[Zawicki]

Im going to keep my vote on Mozric because he seems a bit over protective of Tarion. If ritha doesn't actually say something though, i'm going to have to go against him.

[shotcoder]

I don't understand why my playing style causes suspicion....I post frequently and post my thoughts when I feel they are needed or when I think they bring to light something important. But if you would like more input than I will.....

I would like to say I keep my vote on DeathForce, the verbal attack was enough to make me feel he is for sure a mafia member. I don't understand why an innocent would verbally assault someone who pointed something out about them and didn't even vote for them. I guess you can call it a grudge....

Now Bailey needs to post at some point. We don't need a repeat of the last few games.

This game has been good so far, good posts with good details, and of course it looks like people are playing with the same playing styles they always do. *looks at Moz, Scythes, DF, and P3*

The Tarion ordeal doesn't hold water imo, if he was Mafia wouldn't he be trying to bandwagon everywhere, since that's what you're accusing him of? he said he would pull his vote and he did I just don't see him as a threat.

Ritha might be a threat but the mime gestures may just be for fun or something different in the game.

Aikanaro doesn't help his position with that bandwagon vote. A Mafia move if you ask me......maybe a slip up?

Moz like always is being very anal about his analysis and very thorough. Posts good information about everyone and isn't focusing on one person to prove is mafia but showing the whole picture, to me looks innocent.

Scythes, playing like he always has, so to me looks innocent but that could be just what he wants us to think.

There's my view on this game so far. Everyone else is either quiet and is under the radar or just not a worry to me. But I will keep my eye open.

[scythes]

Hmmm, Tarion is looking quite dodgy, for putting a second vote on Deathforce... Keeping an eye on him.
But I would be more suspicious of those of you who seem so keen for a lynch. After all, Tarion did say:

I'll change this before he gets lynched.


I'm looking at Deathforce and Aikanaro. I think that one of them may well be mafia. The question is, how can we tell?

I'm going to leave my vote on Deathforce. He seems quite defensive, more than is needed for having two votes on him that were clearly not very serious.

Still, the evidence is not conclusive, and I do hope that we don't cause a lynch just yet. I'm liking the amount of discussion we're getting though. It's good to see that everybody but Bailey has posted, and I think that everybody has voted at one point except for Zawicki.

This is the real post that put me in the trail of Mozric. At first I threw out a random vote and it just happened to be him. This post was so incredibly early for him to have some kind of strong feeling toward Deathforce and Aikanaro that he would have to know something we don't, and the only people who know anything more than the rest of us is mafia. I'm keeping my vote on him for now and I'm looking at how other people vote, but I'm also looking at Ritha and a couple other people I think are acting a bit strange or suspicious.

I'm looking at everyone not named Scythes as well! :mrgreen:

[Doohicky]

To be hoest I have already said what I think about who is guilty in this round Aik...
He tried to follow/start a bandwagon and that seems suspicious in my eyes.
But we have to post periodically or we are mod killed so I'm re-stating my point.

[p3990013]

As Ritha hasn't given any info on why he voted for me and for his overall strange behavior:

Unvote
Vote: Ritha

[Subzero]

"The day's third vote count will now begin. Please politely remain silent.

Deathforce has one vote against himself - shotcoder
Tarion'Maseth has one vote against himself - Deathforce
Mozric has two votes against himself - scythes and Zawicki
p3990013 has two votes against himself - ']['Ritha][ and Mozric
Aikanaro has two votes against himself - Doohicky and Baragash
bailey0156 has one vote against himself - Kilroy
']['Ritha][ has one vote against himself - p3990013

Mozric, p3990013 and Aikanaro are jointly closest to being lynched with three each of the necessary eight.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Tarion'Maseth, Aikanaro, bailey0156 and Grotfang."

You're beginning to tire of these 'vote counts' - they interrupt your thoughts at regular intervals, starting with a distorted buzz and finishing with the droning voice of someone ultimately uncaring towards you. There is one thing you've noticed, though - one person, apparently going by the name of bailey0156, has yet to cast a vote and has remained reticent and completely unwilling to speak. Then again, you feel you can't blame him. Everyone else seems to be completely shaken up by the death of Magnus777z. You wonder if perhaps he's -

" - Your kind host would like to inform you that the player bailey0156 has not been playing to his full abilities and will be removed from the game and replaced by another willing participant once one has been located."



Okay, bailey's been inactive since the beginning of the day. He has yet to make a post during the actual day phase and his lost post on the forums was a week ago. I sent him a PM reminding him of this but he didn't respond, so I'll need a replacement or I'll have to mod-kill him. So I'm going to put up a notice for a replacement for a week - if anyone replies by then they take his role, if not then he gets mod-killed. If he posts something before anyone replies then we won't need a replacement.

[Baragash]

Why not offer it to Magnus? I don't think that would affect the game at this stage would it?

[Tarion'Maseth]

Why not offer it to Magnus? I don't think that would affect the game at this stage would it?
It'd make sense since he's had no opportunity to talk to anyone about the game. He went from being signed up to being dead, without any chance to play.

[Doohicky]

I would be happy with this, but we Subzero would need to know for sure that since dieing he has not been talking to anyone outside the game about their guilt/innocence.

[DeathForce]

Well I must say this is most splintered vote I have seen in a game yet.

[p3990013]

I say kill'em all and let God sort them out :P

[Subzero]

Little has been said since the warning earlier, only a few whispered guesses about what will happen to bailey0156 from those too simple or too callous to realise or care about just what this 'replacement' of 'players' implies for all of you. You're about to raise your voice again, to convince the others that the day must progress when, with a dull, heavy click, all of the lights go out at once. Everybody seems to freeze at this, listening for even the slightest sound - if someone was going to be 'replaced' then surely a there must be a way in and if there is a way in then that can be used as a way out and if there is a way out...then you can escape from this nightmare. Just the thought of escape makes you feel light-headed with hope.

But all you hear is a slow, steady hiss, followed by the sound of metal scraping against something else and ending in a deathly silence filled only with anticipation and fear.

Just as thoughts begin to formulate in your head the lights simulatenously flash on again with the same dull sound. You heard nothing - no door, no hatch. No escape. You are left perplexed until you notice that Magnus777z's head is slowly raising, dead eyes half-closed, flecks of frothy drool surrounding his mouth. It's enough to draw all of the breath from your lungs - that is, until you realise that it is merely the needle retracting into his chair that is pulled his head back. It dawns on you that all of this time you and the others have been playing this twisted game you've been playing alongside a corpse.

You turn to the others again, wordlessly communicating with them - your eyes and theirs both show this realization, this disgust - partially with yourself, partially with this entire situation, the kidnapping and the game.

And then someone screams.

You turn back to them and as your eyes flash over Magnus777z for the briefest of moments you notice something happening - movement. Your eyes snap to him and very quickly his body holds the undivided attention of the entire room, save for one other person. He looks up - he opens his eyes fully - his lungs breath, his heart beats and he is alive once again. You can't even begin to comprehend this. This is the stuff of religion, of superstition - this is impossible, yet it's happening right before your eyes. It's a miracle. There's no other explanation you can see - you know enough about the body to understand that once someone is dead and their brain has stopped - there's no coming back. This just has to -

" - The player called Magnus777z has been treated with a calcium gluconate antidote to the acid. Ordinarily injecting hydrofluoric acid directly into a human being's brain would completely prevent them from being conscious and kill them hours later, but tests...simulations have shown that it is possible for a human to be revived from this near-death unconscious stage through the injection of the antidote in addition to various other agents, both natural and artificial. Your benevolent host hopes that this knowledge will encourage you to play more actively in the game and also believes that it is fair that bailey0156 should be removed in the same manner as Magnus777z."

Bailey0156 slumps forward as the tinny sound echoes in your mind, stirring up thoughts of words, ideas, concepts. Life. Death. Justice. Fairness.

These people are sick, you think to yourself. You can't bring yourself to think anything more. They are simply sick.



The practical upshot of this is that Magnus replaces bailey because Magnus hasn't actually said or done anything yet to anyone. As a matter of fact, bailey also dies in the same way Magnus did, and Magnus is essentially revived on the player list.

[Magnus777z]

I'm Backkkkkkkkkkkkk!!!
hopefully I can catch up later tonight.

[p3990013]

Welcome on board! :smt006

Hope you are more lucky this time!

[DeathForce]

I am horrified and amazed by what just happened.

[Zawicki]

Sub, have you ever thought about writing, because these are amazing and they make me want to read a book like this.

[Kilroy]

Alright... unvote: Bailey

No point in that anymore.

[Subzero]

"The day's fourth vote count will now begin. Please politely remain silent.

Deathforce has one vote against himself - shotcoder
Tarion'Maseth has one vote against himself - Deathforce
Mozric has two votes against himself - scythes and Zawicki
p3990013 has two votes against himself - ']['Ritha][ and Mozric
Aikanaro has two votes against himself - Doohicky and Baragash
']['Ritha][ has one vote against himself - p3990013

Mozric, p3990013 and Aikanaro remain jointly closest to being lynched with three each of the necessary eight.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Kilroy, Tarion'Maseth, Aikanaro, Magnus777z and Grotfang.

Your host is disappointed with your recent reluctance to participate. In light of previous events he sees no reason why there is a lack of activity. As such, a deadline has been imposed as per the rules explained earlier. Your host hopes this will provoke thoughtful discussion for the last part of this day. The timer now showing in the corner of your tablet indicates the time remaining until the deadline is reached."

God damn it - as if it wasn't enough that they're playing games with people's lives and giving life only to take it away again these bastards are forcing you into killing someone in cold blood. Before, the mafia didn't even know what was going to happen to their victim but now everyone was very much aware of what lay ahead. The last vote count was completely splintered - nobody truly wanted to kill anyone else.

But did they? And then you realise that it's only a matter of time until people lose their humanity and start playing just for their own survival, doing anything, no matter how horrifying, just so that they can get out of here alive. That must be exactly what your captors want from you. You can feel your gut churning, your fists clenching; you know that's what they want and you know that's what they'll get. Nobody here can hold out forever, not even you. You recall your thoughts earlier - 'I'll get out of here and make them suffer', 'I'll escape even if I have to kill people', 'I'll try to save as many as I can' - and you can't face up to them now that you're really here, on the brink of deciding whether another human being lives or dies.

But you have to, and that's what disgusts you.

Okay, discussion seems to have lagged a bit. There's now a 3-day deadline as of this post. The rules about deadlines specified in rule 4 of the first post apply.


Sub, have you ever thought about writing, because these are amazing and they make me want to read a book like this.
I used to write fluff pieces about 40k but they tended to be pretty bad, reading like a thesaurus to me because I didn't want to use any of the same descriptive words twice. This is probably of a higher quality than the stuff I used to write. It looks like this game is going to have a larger amount of narrative than previous ones so at the end I might compile all of the various pieces of narration throughout the topic into one story, then fill in the gaps with a realistic story (so I'll actually follow what happens in the game and use that as the basis of the in-game sections).

[Aikanaro]

Since I haven't posted in awhile and I need to. I will restate my opinion:

The two people I currently suspect as being Mafia members are Ritha, for not really talking whatsoever and using only hand gestures and Scythes for the reason I posted above. I can't really say I suspect Bailey anymore for obvious reasons, But I will be keeping an eye on what Magnus has to say now that he's back.

Since there is now a deadline on the voting I'm going to put up who I think might be mafia:

Vote: Ritha

[scythes]

I'm starting to lean more toward Ritha than Mozric right now, but I'm going to leave my vote where it is, at least until Ritha posts again. I'd like to see if he has something to say or is going to be sticking with the mime act.

[Zawicki]

I agree with scythes. Lets not go after a possible inoccent until he posts again. If he continues the mime act, then I'll go after him.

[Mozric]

I'm going to wait to see what Ritha has to say, then I'll think about what's been said, go back through the topic, pick the person who I think looks most likely to be mafia, then I'll present a case against them.
I think that's all we'll have time for, so I'll try to give the topic a good read through and make a strong accusation (it'll probably be overly strong, but I think in the last two-three days of this day phase it's worth trying to focus on a few really suspicious people than to scatter suspicions over everyone, like we've been doing)

If we manage to get a mafia it will certainly be awesome (although not unprecedented).

[']['Ritha][]

-Shifts pointer to Mozric, be it to help solidify a vote or for other reasons. But is only doing this because he was forced.-

Unvote

Vote: Mozric

[Mozric]

Vote: Ritha

I think this is self-explanatory.

I'll take off the vote if he starts saying something.

[Baragash]

The problem I'm having here is that despite about half a dozen people threatening Ritha with the lynch, he's still going for it. Given Sub's twisted game, it would not surprise me if it was a "role", and it would totally fit the theme.

Leading us to kill an innocent is the sort of sick, torturous stunt I could see Sub playing on us. (I can already see the "killed one of your own..." post-lynch italics in my head).

I will not be moving my vote at this time.

I also think that's the first time I've ever used twisted as a compliment :P

[DeathForce]

I agree with baragash, like I said before I dont think Ritha CAN talk.

[Mozric]

There are no roles other than 12 standard Innocents and 3 standard Mafiosi.


I don't think Subzero is playing tricky buggers.

And I really don't know why Ritha is doing what he's doing. I don't really want to try to lynch him because it seems like the mafia wouldn't do something that crazy. But I hardly can think that it's benefiting the town. Hell, maybe he's mafia planning to do this the whole game, hoping that we dismiss him as a crazy innocent or secret role. At least that seems more likely to me than subzero lying to us in this sort of way.

[Baragash]

Hence my use of "...". Just because there are no ability-roles, doesn't mean there are no character-roles.

This wouldn't mean Sub was lying, but there is a difference between lying and simply omitting information.

And yes, you're right, it could be some cunning mafioso double-bluff. It just seems so high risk that I'm having trouble accepting that theory.

[Mozric]

I have a theory!
Before I have thought that Deathforce was pretty suspicious because of the way he reacted to a few ordinary bits of suspicion. I say that he sounds overly defensive and he calls me a moron or mafioso.
I've also been looking at p3990013 a bit too. A lot of his posts have been pretty pointless and he seems to be laying low, not making any real accusations.
So these two are at least kinda suspicious, yeah?
Now, look back through the topic. Who are the two people who first started insisting that Ritha has some special role? p3990013 and Deathforce.
This all makes sense (at least to me) if Ritha, p3990013 and Deathforce are the three mafia.
Mind you, Ritha voted for p399013 earlier and p3990013 is voting for Ritha now. But these votes don't seem dangerous for either p or Ritha. Ritha "couldn't" back up his vote for p. p's vote for ritha suggests more that they're separate since it was a first vote for Ritha, but it hardly seems like it'll put ritha in danger of lynch. These two votes, though, could be a distancing tactic between the mafia.

P and Deathforce are both clever mafia players, and I think that Ritha is definately crazy enough to try this sort of gambit as mafia, after convincing p3990013 and Deathforce to spread the theory that he has a character role.

Now, I will easily be proved wrong if at some point in the game one of them dies and is innocent. But I'm putting this theory out here now just in case it turns out to be true that either p, ritha or deathforce are mafia.
Also, just thinking ahead, whether anyone listens to me or not, if I die this night phase don't assume that my theory is correct. I could be completely wrong and the mafia could be taking advantage of this to get a free lynch. Bear it in mind though.

Am I crazy?

[scythes]

I think you're a bit crazy personally Mozric. Deathforce may have been really defensive and all, but he was the same way last game, it seems like it's how he plays, he takes votes against him personally or something.

Baragash's theory kind of makes a little sense, that just because there's no ability roles doesn't mean there's no character roles, and it does seem possible that Ritha doesn't have an ability but can't actually talk because he has is a certain character. This made sense until I looked at Ritha's last post,

-Shifts pointer to Mozric, be it to help solidify a vote or for other reasons. But is only doing this because he was forced.-
Doing this because he was forced seems to imply a controlling force, and this would be an ability role, which Sub said there none. Also, Ritha didn't really give any type of reason for his vote except to solidify the vote against Mozric, almost an admitted bandwagon. Like I said before at some point a single vote will have a lot of power when the person with the most votes gets lynched, it looks like Ritha tried to use that single vote but a bit too early in my opinion.

UNVOTE:MOZRIC

VOTE:RITHA

If Ritha truly is mafia than Mozric's innocence will be proved in my eyes, but It'll be the opposite if Ritha is innocent, my vote will be on Mozric on day 2 if Ritha is shown to be innocent.

[Baragash]

This made sense until I looked at Ritha's last post,

-Shifts pointer to Mozric, be it to help solidify a vote or for other reasons. But is only doing this because he was forced.-
Doing this because he was forced seems to imply a controlling force, and this would be an ability role, which Sub said there none.

I thought he meant forced by behaviour of other players rather than an external force, and even then, if the character-role theory isn't just tosh, you can't rule out Sub himself as the controlling force.

I see some plausibility in Moz's theory, not enough to swing my vote yet. Will try and find a revision gap to review the evidence.

[Subzero]

"The day's fifth vote count will now begin. Please politely remain silent.

Deathforce has one vote against himself - shotcoder
Tarion'Maseth has one vote against himself - Deathforce
Mozric has two votes against himself - Zawicki and ']['Ritha][
Aikanaro has two votes against himself - Doohicky and Baragash
']['Ritha][ has four votes against himself - p3990013, Aikanaro, Mozric and scythes

']['Ritha][ is closest to being lynched with four votes of the necessary eight. If the deadline is reached without a majority vote ']['Ritha][ will be lynched by default.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Kilroy, Tarion'Maseth, Magnus777z and Grotfang.

Your benevolent host is pleased with this resurgence of activity."

By the way, I'll be providing vote counts on every day during a deadline period. Otherwise, it will be one per page hopefully.

[Zawicki]

I think ritha is inoccent now. Sub is counting the *poitning gestures* as votes which makes me think that he has a character role. Baragrash's theory makes some sense to me. So does mozrics. But mozrics is a bit too far out there for me to consider...yet. IMO mozric has been trying to change our opinions a lot. Seems kinda mafia like to me.

[DeathForce]

So lets say Sub is pulling Ritha's strings quite literally, do you think he is pointing at guilty parties or just trying to throw us off. So far he has pointed at P3 and Mozric both of who in turn vote for him.

[Kilroy]

Truth be told I think its just Subzero being sneaky. I'm more then sure that Ritha is innocent. Judging by the Point/Vote thing, I'd assume that Ritha's character is a mute.

[shotcoder]

I think Baragash is right about Ritha. The Idea of an innocent being a mute hasn't been seen but it doesn't mean that it isn't a possibility. This isn't a role but a character trait.

[scythes]

I don't understand the last bit of Ritha's post though, that he was pointing at Mozric because he was being forced. Ritha being controlled by Sub would make his being in this game pointless, it's supposed to be us working things out without any help from the GM. He can't be controlled by another player because there are no ability roles, and that would definately be an ability of some sort. The only other thing I can think of would be a stretch, that he's being forced to do it meaning that this is the only way he can communicate and he's forced to point because he's mute. I don't think he's being controlled by Sub, so I'm tossing that idea out. If he's actually being controlled by another player somehow it would make him a definate mafioso because, as has been said by Sub, only mafioso's can communicate outside the game, day or night. I'm tossing this idea because I believe Sub when he said there are no ability roles. The last is that he's merely a mute, this would put him on equal ground with the rest of us since he might or might not be mafia because he's playing the game without any outside influence like the rest of us.

Seeing the error of my ways from earlier I'm going to...

UNVOTE: RITHA

and ...

VOTE:MOZRIC

again. He still looks extremely guilty to me, and most of the time your first instinct is right.

[Mozric]

Guys, ritha's *pointing* is NOT being counted as votes. Look closely:

['Ritha][]-Shifts pointer to Mozric, be it to help solidify a vote or for other reasons. But is only doing this because he was forced.-

Unvote

Vote: Mozric
Am I the only one who noticed that he actually is using "Vote: player"?


Zawicki: You say that I seem like mafia because I'm trying to change your opinion? You could just as easily say that a player being careful not to say much seems like mafia. You can't play this game as an innocent very effectively without trying to change people's opinion.

I still think that you guys are assuming too much by thinking that Ritha is a mute.

Evidence 1: Ritha is not speaking directly in his posts
Evidence 2: Subzero has said that there are no special roles in this game.

So either Ritha is an innocent playing silly buggers, a mafia trying a crazy gambit or Subzero is lying.
I'll prefer the explanation consistent with evidence 1&2 over one that assumes Subzero is lying.
I'm thinking of asking Ritha to "*point frantically at self*" if he really does have a mute-role... but, really, even if he didn't have the role he could just pretend some more.


If Ritha truly is mafia than Mozric's innocence will be proved in my eyes, but It'll be the opposite if Ritha is innocent, my vote will be on Mozric on day 2 if Ritha is shown to be innocent.
Fair enough scythes.
If Ritha is lynched and he is not mafia, then I promise to be the first to put a vote on myself, and leave it there for the whole day phase. If I screw up this badly, it's probably better that I don't get the chance to vote for anybody tomorrow anyway. I just ask that you all don't lynch me in the first five minutes, let some discussion happen before going for a lynch (otherwise the mafia will just be able to hide behind all the "revenge votes" for me).

And as for your comment regarding Deathforce... if that's the way he plays, then I guess that part of my theory starts to sink. I was dead for most of last game, so I wasn't paying that much attention to individual play-styles.

[DeathForce]

Yes please don't take my comment personal I would have called anyone who voted for me a moron

[Zawicki]

Threating to vote for ones self seems very odd to me. Maybe mozric is getting a bit worried he might hbge lynched. It just seems wierd and makes me think he's mafia even more.

[Aikanaro]

Alright. Ritha has pretty much got my vote for him as being mafia. If he truly was innocent I believe he would have said something by now, and I dont' believe that Sub is controlling Ritha considering there are no special roles and I don't think Sub would use semantics like that to make a "puppet". As a few have come to believe he has.

[Zawicki]

Now, you see aik. Thats what makes me feel he's inoccent. If you were a mafia why would you take such a big risk like that. There has to be more to it than ritha just not wanting to speak.

I have come up wioth another theory about ritha though. Maybe the l;ast person to vote against him, he ahs to vote against. There might be a gap in my theory (I havnt really gone back to look through the topic but this is because my computer is screwed up so i have to use the slow family one. Which is why i don't want to ahve to flip through all the pages) but I'm just trying to figure out why Ritha is acting so strane.

Oh and mozric. I failed to see he wrote vote. An error on my part.

[DeathForce]

I agree with Zawicki, Aikanano what we are saying is perfectly plausible, besides who said Sub was telling us the truth? If he said the earth was flat would you believe that as well? Don't be a sheep

[']['Ritha][]

-Continues pointing while listening to the assorted conversations going on. Formulates more ideas, but keeps pointing at Mozzy. Also appears to be taking notes with the other hand on what people are saying...-

[Mozric]

Can you tell us what you've learnt so far, Ritha?

[DeathForce]

unvote

Vote:Mozric

leave the mute alone man!

[Mozric]

I still don't get why you think it's so certain that ritha has a special role, and even if that is the case, why you think that that proves he is pro-town.

[DeathForce]

hes more trustworthy then the rest of you snakes.

[Baragash]

Guys, ritha's *pointing* is NOT being counted as votes. Look closely:

['Ritha][]-Shifts pointer to Mozric, be it to help solidify a vote or for other reasons. But is only doing this because he was forced.-

Unvote

Vote: Mozric
Am I the only one who noticed that he actually is using "Vote: player"?

I'm not sure what you're getting at, I always assumed regardless of the level of roleplaying in any Mafia game you'd keep that mechanism for clarity (as an admin function if you like)


Evidence 1: Ritha is not speaking directly in his posts
Evidence 2: Subzero has said that there are no special roles in this game.

So either Ritha is an innocent playing silly buggers, a mafia trying a crazy gambit or Subzero is lying.
I'll prefer the explanation consistent with evidence 1&2 over one that assumes Subzero is lying.
I'm thinking of asking Ritha to "*point frantically at self*" if he really does have a mute-role... but, really, even if he didn't have the role he could just pretend some more.

Like I said, if there are character-roles, Sub isn't technically lying, just messing with our heads by omitting useful information. I presume you disagree as you haven't mentioned it?


If Ritha is lynched and he is not mafia, then I promise to be the first to put a vote on myself, and leave it there for the whole day phase. If I screw up this badly, it's probably better that I don't get the chance to vote for anybody tomorrow anyway. I just ask that you all don't lynch me in the first five minutes, let some discussion happen before going for a lynch (otherwise the mafia will just be able to hide behind all the "revenge votes" for me).

He he, more pre-emptive self-coverage as right at the start?


And as for your comment regarding Deathforce... if that's the way he plays, then I guess that part of my theory starts to sink. I was dead for most of last game, so I wasn't paying that much attention to individual play-styles.

I would describe DF's play style as "abrasive" (although not rude), and perhaps mildly "in your face".

I'm having trouble deciding if you're Mafia sticking to the trail like a bloodhound because if you back down we all might think you wish to avoid the attention, or if your mind is really made up about Ritha. It's not like he's the only dodgy person up to this point. Yes, Ritha's behaviour is dodgy, but dodgy enough for all this attention? I can't help but feel it would be an ideal opportunity for the Mafia to throw us off the real scent.

[Mozric]

As I said before, I was planning to make a case and try to stick to it.

I'm actually a bit disappointed that no other real discussion has come up. You all have responded to my question of Ritha and Ritha has continued acting weirdly, but no other names have been mentioned but mine. I don't think things are looking good for the town if this is what's happening.

Seems like whatever I say puts me in more suspicion.

Anyway, if you're really serious about moving the discussion elsewhere perhaps I could kickstart it with two names. Zawicki and Aikanaro. Assuming I'm wrong about Deathforce and p, these two are looking quite dodgy. Both seem to be trying to be yes-men and seem to want to build up the pressure on whoever's on the latest trail of the bandwagon.

Anyway, there's only a day left for this phase if that, so I suggest we start getting serious. If it's not too late.

Unvote

Since my attempt to provoke an honest reaction out of Ritha and try to get discussion going for the final few days was a complete failure (except perhaps to throw myself on the furnace, which would be awesome for us if I'm actually mafia), I'm going to dismiss myself from the voting and watch with probable slight annoyance about how it turns out. I was hoping that we'd be able to have better discussion with a deadline imposed, but that's how the cookie crumbles.
I still think that Ritha does NOT have a role, character or ability. I don't think this necessarily makes him mafia (although the Deathforce/p/Ritha mafia tactic is still possible), but the way he has continued to keep us this charade has just gotten me more annoyed at him.
Since I may be dead before I get to post again, I'll post a quick list of my suspicions so that in death I may still help a bit:
Aikanaro -- dodgy voting and attempted lurking
Zawicki -- appears manipulative and a bit too quiet
Subzero -- on the (I think remote) possibility that ritha actually has a role, I'll be coming after this guy

[Subzero]

"The day's sixth vote count will now begin. Please politely remain silent.

Deathforce has one vote against himself - shotcoder
Mozric has four votes against himself - Zawicki, ']['Ritha][, scythes and DeathForce
Aikanaro has two votes against himself - Doohicky and Baragash
']['Ritha][ has two votes against himself - p3990013 and Aikanaro

Mozric is closest to being lynched with four votes of the necessary eight. If the deadline is reached without a majority vote Mozric will be lynched by default.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Kilroy, Tarion'Maseth, Magnus777z, Mozric and Grotfang.

Your benevolent host hopes that this discussion entertains you as much as them."

[Doohicky]

Sorry folks... Been away all weekend.

Hmm.. seems to be a lot of discussion going on here with Mozric accusing Ritha and a few people accusing Mozric because of it.

I am still very suspicious of Aik, but it looks like keeping my vote on him will be a waste. So now I have to think who looks to be guilty from the two main suspects (if any are).

I have to admit I am confused by Ritha's actions and that is obviously bringing me towards voting for him. I have one theory about why he may be acting like he is, but I am not sure how sound it is.

Anyway, if there are no roles at all in this game then Ritha is pointing and acting like that of his own accord. If that is the case I can only see one reason for it. He is trying to sacrifice himself and get lynched. Now, you may ask why do that since his role can't be a suicide one. My answer is that he's a Mafia man and is getting killed to protect the other Mafia. If the other two members get in the accusations against him early and he is found to be Mafia, they will be next to immune from lynching. After all they ferreted out a Mafia member and that proves they are innocent.

Of course I could be completely wrong about this. Either way, the only way I see to test this theory is to lynch Ritha and see if he is Mafia.

Unvote

Vote - Ritha

[Grotfang]

Sorry I haven't posted over the weekend, things got more hectic than I'd planned (I spent 10 hrs travelling yesterday to work for 6 :().

Anyhoos. I said a few pages ago that if Ritha didn't justify his actions, then I would be voting for him and I intend on sticking to that. I do not believe he has any special role, as sub made it abundantly clear that everyone's PMs (mafia or innocent) would be the same - they are posted in the first page, people! If we relax our opinion on the truthfulness of that claim, then why should we not accept claims of other abilities?

In addition, Ritha's last post really bugged me. Taking notes? So, he is basing his opinion on intelligent, thought out observations; he just won't tell us what they are. All I see there is someone who is unwilling, for some reason, to contribute to the pro-town side. Now, if he is pro-town, then he is of no value. If he is mafia, then (although I will accept that silence is a perfectly viable tactic, though it does mean no confounding information can be introduced) in my opinion he simply isn't playing very fairly and truly to the game.

I see no advantage in his actions if he is a pro-town player, and a slight advantage that could be argued if he is mafia. Either way, it is annoying and of little value to the town.

Now, I feel I ought to highlight the obvious assumptions in these arguments, as many people have presented them:

1) Sub is not playing games with us (no evidence either way - this is the strongest assumption of the lot). If there is a role that has been introduced, then we are way off in our estimations. However, in some ways it would be beneficial to know if this is the case, as if one role has been added, others may have been too,

2) The mime actions have a greater benefit to the mafia than the town. A tenuous assumption really only given because I don't believe there is any advantage to the town, and based on past games lurking seems to be a viable tactic; I belive the mime actions are tantamount to lurking, given the lack of contribution.

Other suspicions:

Mozric - I realise he has been one of the main posters in this thread and will therefore inevitably appear suspicious. However, although he has defended individuals and appeared to read more than I neccessarily would into certain posts, I don't see any real pattern to his actions, and if he is mafia I would have no clue who he was working with. This doesn't mean he can't be mafia, just that I want to see more posts and more clues before I see him as truly suspicious.

Deathforce - Interesting. Quite an outspoken form of gameplay that makes me feel as though he's getting fairly anxsty whenever suspicions are cast at him. I'm unsure as to whether this means he's a mafia who isn't intended to be in the front line at this moment in time, or whether he is innocent and just really enjoys staying in the game ;) At the moment, I'm leaning towards innocent, as I recognise the feeling and am pretty much the same when I feel my posts are wrongly interpreted.

Therefore:

Vote: Ritha

I apologise again for my brief period of inactivity.

[Tarion'Maseth]

[quote]
Anyhoos. I said a few pages ago that if Ritha didn't justify his actions, then I would be voting for him and I intend on sticking to that. I do not believe he has any special role, as sub made it abundantly clear that everyone's PMs (mafia or innocent) would be the same - they are posted in the first page, people! If we relax our opinion on the truthfulness of that claim, then why should we not accept claims of other abilities?

In addition, Ritha's last post really bugged me. Taking notes? So, he is basing his opinion on intelligent, thought out observations; he just won't tell us what they are. All I see there is someone who is unwilling, for some reason, to contribute to the pro-town side. Now, if he is pro-town, then he is of no value. If he is mafia, then (although I will accept that silence is a perfectly viable tactic, though it does mean no confounding information can be introduced) in my opinion he simply isn't playing very fairly and truly to the game.
[quote]

That's my theory. We know the PMs everyone got. There's no reason for Subzero to give someone a character role in a game designed to go "back to basics". Either, Subzero is deliberately misleading us from the start and defying the very point of the game he set up, or Ritha is acting like a mime from his own free will.

If that's the case, then he's going to be useless for the town. He's giving no reasons for his votes, and without reasoning, we cannot judge whether he's voting for good reasons or bad ones. Even if he's not a Mafia, he might as well be. He's contributing nothing to the town apart from a vote. It's the same as someone inactive, posting only their votes, except he's got reasons for all of his.

I think I'm going to have to Vote: Ritha

[Kilroy]

I don't believe that Tarion. Every Pro-Town player will be needed. Even if Subzero didn't decide to play around with his role he probably would have realized that playing mime would attract all sorts of crap. Being inactive might be somebody trying to keep a low profile. Acting like a mime is counter-intuitive to that point.

[Baragash]

If that's the case, then he's going to be useless for the town. He's giving no reasons for his votes, and without reasoning, we cannot judge whether he's voting for good reasons or bad ones. Even if he's not a Mafia, he might as well be. He's contributing nothing to the town apart from a vote. It's the same as someone inactive, posting only their votes, except he's got reasons for all of his.

If he is innocent then it's just one less night kill for the Mafia to have to make if we do it.

Dodgy logic has added Tarion to my list with Aik and Moz (previously explained, reasoning still stands) as most likely suspects.

[Tarion'Maseth]

If that's the case, then he's going to be useless for the town. He's giving no reasons for his votes, and without reasoning, we cannot judge whether he's voting for good reasons or bad ones. Even if he's not a Mafia, he might as well be. He's contributing nothing to the town apart from a vote. It's the same as someone inactive, posting only their votes, except he's got reasons for all of his.

If he is innocent then it's just one less night kill for the Mafia to have to make if we do it.

Dodgy logic has added Tarion to my list with Aik and Moz (previously explained, reasoning still stands) as most likely suspects.
"If he is innocent" - That's my point. We have no way of judging whether he is or not. Mafia is all about analysing arguments (As you're doing, right now). With Ritha, we cannot do that. All we can do is follow his voting patterns, which means we'd need a long time to decide on his innocence or guilt. He may as well be lurking.

[Tarion'Maseth]

Sorry, I missed this out. Subzero has said before he doesn't like us editing posts so:


I don't believe that Tarion. Every Pro-Town player will be needed. Even if Subzero didn't decide to play around with his role he probably would have realized that playing mime would attract all sorts of crap. Being inactive might be somebody trying to keep a low profile. Acting like a mime is counter-intuitive to that point.
But it's the same process. Being inactive allows players to avoid their arguments being analysed, so no-one can make a decision on them. Not making any arguments or justifying your votes at all does the same thing.

Going to go into a little bit more detail in response to Baragash also:

Mafia is about uninformed majorities versus informed minorities. The majority attempts to become informed by analysing arguments and voting patterns. Each individual typically shares their arguments in order to facilitate this. The Mafia attempts to keep the town uninformed, by killing off key members, and spreading misinformation (or no information at all).

Ritha spreads no information, apart from his vote count. This makes him either Mafia, or what I would describe as "Selfish pro-Town". He's not helping the town become informed. In fact, he's actively working against that goal, sharing only his vote, and giving no explanation beyond *pointing*. I can't see a possible reason for a pro-town player to do this, as it doesn't do anything but hurt the town. I've already explained why I think he's not got a character role (The title is "Back to Basics". Having someone post as a mime is quite a step away from basics). From this, it seems to follow that he's working against the town. He's either Mafia, or someone trying to screw us over anyway.

[Grotfang]

Two issues with Kilroy's argument which I think can be used to respond with many other queries regarding my thoughts (summary at the bottom):


Every Pro-Town player will be needed.

Agreed. But unfortunately we can't confirm whether or not someone is pro-town until they're lynched or night killed. Now, what we can do is to apply logic to determine who is most beneficial to dispose of. Let's assume that we have no knowledge of who is mafia or pro-town. A random lynching is highly likely to dispose of a pro-towner (given the ratios we're dealing with). However, fortunately, we can balance these odds slightly. We have some information to go on. Only, the information we have is purely subjective quantifications of people's statements. Nothing concrete. What it boils down to is narrowing down a field of suspects by disposing of everyone suspicious or unhelpful. Start with whoever is the most suspicious and work downwards until we're left either with only pro-towners or a mafia win.

In the first day phase, there is no real benefit to casting suspicions too willy nilly. If everyone stayed silent, then (again) we would have no informations. Not enough time, or posts, has passed to be confident that the mafia has hugely slipped up and we can be sure that the second night kill will probably reveal more about their thoughts and insecurities that we can play off. So, where does that leave us? We can either build on tenuous assumptions of who seems to be most "aggressive" or "defensive", but in the end that often boils down to playing style.

So, what's the alternative? We either kill off someone who appears suspicious, but is probably just an enthusiatic pro-towner, or alternatively we lynch a certain unhelpful who, in my opinion, has a slightly greater (and only very slightly) chance of being mafia due to his actions than anyone else.


playing mime would attract all sorts of crap. Being inactive might be somebody trying to keep a low profile. Acting like a mime is counter-intuitive to that point.

A very quick point, but worth addressing. Second guessing mafia behaviour is unlikely to work. Ritha could be there purely as a sacrificial lamb to draw attentions away from two other mafia players. He could be a bored innocent trying to liven up his role. We don't know and it's rarely worth guessing.

Summary:

1) The loss of a guarenteed unhelpful player gives a greater chance of pro-town benefit than that provided by lynching any of the other "suspicious" players.

2) Second-guessing behavious as mafia or pro-town is unhelpful during this initial day-phase (although, obviously, useful in subsequent phases) and decisions should be based on more definite measures.

[p3990013]

Not much to add. Still voting for Ritha...

Hope we are lucky...

[shotcoder]

In addition, Ritha's last post really bugged me. Taking notes? So, he is basing his opinion on intelligent, thought out observations; he just won't tell us what they are. All I see there is someone who is unwilling, for some reason, to contribute to the pro-town side. Now, if he is pro-town, then he is of no value. If he is mafia, then (although I will accept that silence is a perfectly viable tactic, though it does mean no confounding information can be introduced) in my opinion he simply isn't playing very fairly and truly to the game.

I see no advantage in his actions if he is a pro-town player, and a slight advantage that could be argued if he is mafia. Either way, it is annoying and of little value to the town.



This has to be one of the most intelligent things I've seen so far in this game. DeathForce has settled down and Aik still looks suspicious to me but Grotfang really persuaded me with his last post. What is the point in keeping someone who won't help? even if he is an innocent he won't help and the chance he is a mafia member we could gain a huge advantage early.

unvote: DeathForce

Vote: Ritha

[DeathForce]

There is no way he is mafia who the hell would set them selves up like that.

[shotcoder]

I've found in the three games I've played that sometimes the first day isn't always about finding who would be mafia but who is contributing the least or backing down from their opinions the most. Ritha is providing little to no info, if he is a mute I am sorry for our loss but he hasn't helped much at all.

Not only does this get rid of a potential Mafia member or least helpful pro-towner but it gives us more information through a night kill. I know we don't like going to three innocents so early but look at what they did last game.

[']['Ritha][]

-Draws a picture-

[shotcoder]

ok......we're getting off course and our votes are shit?

[DeathForce]

see the mute knows whats up!

[Aikanaro]

Well at least were getting somewhere with him now, but I still don't think that that's good enough proof that he is innocent or giving enough info to help find the mafia. He's kind of just insulting us on paper now lol.

[']['Ritha][]

-Draws another picture and gesticulates at it-

[Aikanaro]

haha Holy Crap that looks Demonic. I'm gonna make a wild guess here but I think you don't like Mozric at the moment.

[shotcoder]

Can I ask you to attempt to draw a picture why you think Moz is Mafia?

unvote

[Tarion'Maseth]

:lol:

Ritha, that's amazing. I absolutely love it. I'm with shotcoder. A picture of your reasoning, if possible, would be great.

[scythes]

What I think is funny is this has pretty much turned into the Ritha vs Mozric show. You all do realise they could both be innocents and the real mafia could be manipulating the strangeness of this game to their own means. I haven't taken the time to look back who could be guilty of this, but I am getting some decent info on who is changing votes, why, and what people are posting in general. I think Ritha is actually contributing quite a bit to this game, if not directly, then through what everyone else says about him and how they say it. Regardless, my vote remains on Mozric for now for reasons stated in almost all of my other posts thus far.

The whole cherades thing is odd, I'd love to see how he draws up reasoning.

[shotcoder]

He started adding some info and I really like his way of communicating. I'm really worried now, I thought Moz was innocent for the longest time.

I'm banking on Ritha posting his reasoning so spared him the chance of losing his life before hand. I'm lost now.

[Tarion'Maseth]

He started adding some info and I really like his way of communicating. I'm really worried now, I thought Moz was innocent for the longest time.

I'm banking on Ritha posting his reasoning so spared him the chance of losing his life before hand. I'm lost now.
Ritha communicating doesn't change Mozrics status. We know Ritha doesn't have any knowledge that we don't (First post in the thread). So all it is is another vote. Personally, it's swaying me, but I don't think it's necessarily right.

[shotcoder]

He started adding some info and I really like his way of communicating. I'm really worried now, I thought Moz was innocent for the longest time.

I'm banking on Ritha posting his reasoning so spared him the chance of losing his life before hand. I'm lost now.
Ritha communicating doesn't change Mozrics status. We know Ritha doesn't have any knowledge that we don't (First post in the thread). So all it is is another vote. Personally, it's swaying me, but I don't think it's necessarily right.

That's exactly what I mean, we have no idea who's right, but we can't simply look over Ritha's posts.

[']['Ritha][]

-More pictures, happily! Thumbs up to Scythes!-

[']['Ritha][]

-Draws up some reasoning for people, and does apologetic squirming for the double post-

[Baragash]

Looks like "Moz and a.n.other (ie those who Ritha suspects) look on whilst everyone bandwagons Ritha"

Care to point at a.n.other for us?

[Subzero]

"The day's seventh vote count will now begin. Please politely remain silent.

Mozric has four votes against himself - Zawicki, ']['Ritha][, scythes and DeathForce
Aikanaro has one vote against himself - Baragash
']['Ritha][ has five votes against himself - p3990013, Aikanaro, Doohicky, Grotfang and Tarion'maseth

']['Ritha][ is closest to being lynched with five votes of the necessary eight. If the deadline is reached without a majority vote ']['Ritha][ will be lynched by default.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Kilroy, Magnus777z, Mozric and shotcoder.

This day phase has about 6 hours left so you should get in all the last-minute discussion you can.

[p3990013]

Either Ritha is mute, or he is mocking us...

[DeathForce]

hes obviously mute :?

[Doohicky]

Okay, Ritha is now adding to the game, and in such a funny way, I can't bring myself to vote him off yet! LOL

I changed my vote from Aik because of my suspicions of Ritha, but now that he has started contributing I am going back to Aik, he hasn't done anything that makes him less suspicious (It was simply that Ritha was more suspicious)

Unvote

Vote: Aikanaro

[Grotfang]

Damn you Ritha!

So, where does this leave us? Ritha has started describing his opinions, but no more than we already knew. There is still no justification for his votes and (let's be honest) a picture of Mozric with horns is about as useful as "-points finger-". There is still no attempt to justify his opinions - they are the same concepts in a different format.

However, I can't get past the fact that those pictures are both entertaining and present. He is posting. Unfortunately, I suppose at this stage (4 votes for Ritha and Mozric at this point) if I go back on my vote I am essentially voting for Mozric, while if I stick we have a tie. I do not belive Mozric to be suspicious at this point (see my previous post) so I will not retract my vote for Ritha. IMO a lynch for him at this stage is more beneficial to the town than lynching Mozric would be.

I sincerely apologise to Ritha if my thoughts are off course and he does in fact have a particular role as a mute. On the other hand, if he is innocent without a mute role, I believe (as I have already made clear) that lynching him will not do any more than removing bodies for the mafia's night kills. At least Mozric has made comments that we can analyse in the next day phase in light of the information we gain from Ritha's demise.

[Mozric]

I do not belive Mozric to be suspicious at this point (see my previous post) so I will not retract my vote for Ritha. IMO a lynch for him at this stage is more beneficial to the town than lynching Mozric would be.

...

At least Mozric has made comments that we can analyse in the next day phase in light of the information we gain from Ritha's demise.
I know I'm a bit biased in that I want to keep on playing the game, but in light of this sort of argument, I think I'm going to go back on my previous promise and

Vote: Ritha

*crosses fingers*

[Subzero]

Finally the deadline passes and the timers disappear from your tablets. The player known as ']['Ritha][ has been lynched by a very small margin and -

- he casually begins to get up. It strikes you that there's no reason for anyone to be sitting down; there's nothing enforcing this and it just might be the case that the only ways for the bastards to kill you are all hidden in the chair. But before he can actually do anything wiry restraints shoot out around his ankles, wrists and next, slowly constricting and pulling him inwards. You give a wide-eyed glance at the two people sitting beside you – one nods silently, the other gulps nervously. Hopefully they understand – there's no reason for you all to listen to what these sadists say and now that it's come down to it, now that someone really is about to die, you feel that you have the determination to do something about it now that someone's in real danger right before your eyes.

“']['Ritha][ will now be removed, please politely remain in your seats and - what?!”

This burst of emotion is jarring to all of you – the previously apathetic announcer sounded for once as if they were a human being and you take no small amount of pleasure in the fact that not everything seems to be going their way. The tannoy buzzes continuously in the announcer's absence and you strain your senses, trying to hear anything useful, anything at all.

But there's nothing. You sink back into your seat, depressed and wondering just what you were listening for in the first place. Rather than sitting around trying to eavesdrop on a no doubt useless conversation, you should be thinking of a way to get ']['Ritha][ out of his restraints. You and the others jump up and head straight for ']['Ritha][, ideas forming in your head about how to break him free.

The tannoy emits a low, rasping laugh. You suddenly feel young, oh so young, and the voice seems far too ancient to belong to any living creature, human or otherwise. Before you know it you and the others have frozen, your entire body not daring to move. Instead, out of instinct, every fibre of your body is listening intently, caught between fight and flight and completely confused.

“...WONDERFUL...THESE NEW ONES SHOW...GREAT PROMISE...”

The voice cuts through you, something you never thought a voice could do – despite being less than a whisper it seems louder than a roar. It then fades out in another laugh, leaving you to recover from your paralysis.

Now, if you can just find a way to get ']['Ritha][ out of -

- you recoil as you come to your senses, realizing that the man before you is already gone. He writhes violently in his restraints for a few brief seconds before collapsing, his head lolling forward to reveal two needles side by side, penetrating his skull and slowly forcing the last of a pus-like liquid into his brain. Clutching your stomach, you fall forwards, grab the table to support yourself and vomit. The once-pristine chair and its deadly machinery, gleaming under the light, become covered with a mixture of your vomit and a small trickle of ']['Ritha]['s blood, but you're in no position to care that much any more. Your breath rasps a little through your vomit- and phlegm-coated throat as you look up at the side of ']['Ritha]['s face. His eyes are still moist – he isn't even dead yet – but there's nothing you can do to help him. Nothing except having someone be so boring for the bastard host that he gets replaced by ']['Ritha][. But that wouldn't get you anywhere – you'd just be exchanging one life for another. Sinking to the ground, you realize just what you've done.

You've killed someone.

You killed them, knowing exactly what you were doing. It hits you that no matter what you could have done he would have died – if you refrained from taking part in this sick game he would have been lynched by someone else. If you took part you would have killed him. And that voice earlier...you can't explain it, you don't understand, but you simply know that there's no way a person with a voice like that would allow you any opportunity to help someone once the mob has made their decision. That's not even the worst of it.

You killed someone and it was so easy to do it.

Similar thoughts seem to be on everyone's minds and a pall of silence and despair falls over the remaining thirteen of you.

The announcer's voice returns to the silent tannoy but this time shaken and scared:“']['Ritha][ has...has been lynched by default. He was an Innocent. Your...benevolent host would like me to inform you that the method in this instance was a solution containing genetically engineered natural killer cells, causing wide-scale cell death. Your benevolent host hopes that this variety of methods used to remove players from the game grants you as much...as much entertainment as it does them.”

']['Ritha][ - Innocent – injected with natural killer cells on day 1

It's now night 1. Night 1 will end in 48 hours.

[Kilroy]

Damn! 6 hours late! Bullocks.

[Subzero]

You still can't believe it. The voice that completely paralysed you just couldn't be real. Your mind flashes back to horror movies you've seen, with their unnatural noises purposely designed to send a jolt of fear through your body, but this was something else entirely. Maybe that was the problem...that it was real. That it sounded beyond any living creature, but that it was still so very real Not just that, but the still body in front of you disturbs you. ']['Ritha]['s still alive, but it doesn't look that way and seeing the needles through his eyes immediately makes you imagine yourself in the same situation, raising every hair on your body. If this is that thing you've heard of...unconscious sympathy, perhaps, you wish it didn't exist.

A stern, uncaring voice jerks you out of your horrified reverie: “the second night, night 1, will now begin. You must remain seated and complete your night action as before. Punishment will be severe for anyone who disobeys these simple rules as ']['Ritha][ did.”

You raise yourself from the ground, recoil slightly from the sharp, putrid odour of the vomit that stains the collar of your shirt and glance around at the other prisoners with wide eyes round with fear, preparing to go back to your seat and resign yourself to this inhuman hell. But instead of compliant and obedient players, you see people ignoring the announcer's commands – ignoring the warning of punishment. One by one, your fellow prisoners slowly raise themselves from their chairs, a few of them fearfully leaping away once they can stand to escape any restraints that might appear. They aren't listening to the instructions any more and if they are they don't give a damn.

In response the announcer takes a harsher tone with their command: “Punishment will be severe for anyone who disobeys the rules. Punishment will be meted out. Return to your seats and complete your actions so that the game may continue.”

Somebody throws their tablet onto the floor and stamps on it, cracking the touch-screen. A few more people feverishly run their hands up, down and along the weathered stone walls looking for any sign of an exit – they're panicked and afraid, but at least resisting the orders of that disembodied voice, which you note is accompanied by a high-pitched whine.

“You will be punished if you continue to break the rules. You must return to your seats and you must complete your actions. You must comply before the game can continue.”

Drawing yourself up to your full height, you take in the scene in front of you. Rather than cowing everyone the threats and orders just spur people on. Your companions talk amongst themselves, congratulating each other and cursing at the tannoy and the whining noise that grows higher- and higher-pitched, laughing due to their adrenaline high as their actions become more frantic, more violent and a group of people draw together to try and overturn the table but it's stuck to the floor but it doesn't matter -

“You will return to your seats. Now. You will -”

- and you finally snap out of your reverie, draw your tablet back and hurl it at the tannoy. The machine shrieks painfully, wails and finally falls silent altogether after a harsh buzz of static, the whine disappearing along with it. You realize that now your captors are as powerless and impotent as you felt earlier. You've turned the tables on them – well, not really, because the table won't budge, but hey, you've managed to do something.

And then darkness encroaches from all sides as you slump to the floor and lose consciousness.



It's dark. Dark.

Voice says...”take the tablet.”

Reach out. Touch the tablet.

What do they want? Feel tired.

Grasp the tablet in hand, waiting for the voice again.

“Take out the stylus.”

Fumble with the stylus. Fumble and scratch at it. Pull it free, finally. Mind finally coming to, little by little.

“Complete your action now.”

Action. Action. Action...

Remember that. The action. The game.

Words. A word.

Scrawling on the screen.

Fall forwards.

Cold metal?

Very cold.

A Humming. A Grinding. A Hissing.

A colder draft.

Nice air. Feels nice.



You can see a thin sliver of light. Pulling open your eyes a little wider lets more light in, waking you up even more. Then a splitting headache kicks in and you wince and groan your way back into consciousness and reality whilst you draw yourself back – and your back hits the giant metal slab that is the back on the chair. What happened? One minute you were smashing stuff up and – you wince as another wave of pain passes through your forehead – the next minute you wake up to one hell of a headache, which must mean you fell unconscious at some point, so...

...damn it. Was it some kind of sleeping gas? You finally remember your mind shutting down within the seconds just after you broke the tannoy.. Those bastards. They really -

They really...

...There isn't any point in struggling any more. You recall earlier, when ']['Ritha][ was restrained. You recall the mayhem just a few moments ago, just a few moments...

You glance at your wrist to check the time but your watch is gone. You look up but something else is very different; your clothes have been replaced with a simple robe and cloth trousers, both dull shades of grey. They feel rough, stiff and uncomfortable.

Everybody's wearing them. Everybody looks the same now.

But this doesn't cause you despair. That must be what those bastards want - conformity. No, this reminds you that everyone here is in the same situation, that everyone has a common goal.

'Take that, you fuckers', you think, 'your cheap mind game failed'. You look around at everyone else, united with the same purpose now, skirting your vision around ']['Ritha][ and bailey0156. Everyone -

- there's an empty seat. It's Kilroy's. He's gone.

“The second day phase will now begin.”

Kilroy – Innocent – disappeared in night 1

It is now day 2. 7 votes are required to lynch someone.

[Zawicki]

Well, there goes another innocent. Im sticking my vote on mozric. He really wanted ritha dead. Even when ritha started to contribute, he kept on him. He's looking very suspicious to me.

Im going to be leaving for a week in colorado tomorrow, so if I'm inactive thats why. I might be able to get a computer up there (or post off of my wii) but who knows. sorry for the ionconvience.

[Kilroy]

Saw that one coming. I've yet to live to see Night 2.

[Tarion'Maseth]

Title: The Hows, Whys, and Mozric

Large message coming up. Cliff notes to follow. Just so you know, I'll be using italics for quotes, as I don't want to make this too long.

Firstly, Mozric himself has stated there shouldn't be any benefit of the doubt in this game (Mozric: similarly I don't expect you to believe that I'm innocent for no good reason.). With that in mind, we should leave no rock unturned, and if he appears more guilty than everyone else, there's a good chance he is. And as the town, we need to act on that instinct.

Secondly, if you look at the Mozric/Ritha battle, Ritha was pointing fingers at Mozric all along. We can't know his reasoning, but Mozric contributed heavily to the lynching of him, and he was innocent. I think the odds are, Ritha was onto something.

Thirdly (And far from seriously), he's continued to make use of the evil badger avatar. Hardly seems like the action of an innocent man! :P


Cliff notes:
Ritha suspected Mozric.
Mozric killed Ritha.
Ritha = Innocent
Mozric = Guilty
Vote: Mozric

[Baragash]

Needless to say I will be reviewing yesterday to see who was hard after Ritha.....IIRC that puts Aik and Grotfang in a shady position, and Moz, who was my original suspicion and vote at the start of yesterday.

[Mozric]

Ahhh, shit.

It looks like I'm fairly fucked now.
Anyway, I'll attempt a defense.

If I were mafia, would I really go after Ritha so hard? Wouldn't I just try to lurk a bit more? I know this won't convince everybody (especially those who read so much into an innocent avatar change Tarion), but look at my actions and ask yourself: Are they the actions of a mafioso trying to manipulate the game from the shadows or are they the actions of an innocent trying to provoke discussion.

I think we have a lot to go on from yesterday.
I'm not going to hold to my promise of voting for myself, as that was really quite an emo thing to say which probably won't achieve anything. I won't, however, put votes on people today unless there is already great support for lynching somebody.

I have a few suspicions, but I'd like to see what people say first. I just ask that even if you are all suspicious of me, don't lynch me just yet. That'd be playing into the mafia's hands. Once I get up to about 4 votes I think I'll get the message, and anyone else who thinks I'm guilty should probably just say "I think you're guilty" or something rather than getting the vote close to a premature lynch.

[DeathForce]

vote mozric

lynching my mute buddy was a bad move dude! :smt013

[Mozric]

But I was right at least... he didn't have a special role.

[Magnus777z]

Moz does look guilty as hell right now, but he does have a point that sticking on someone is unmafia like. On the otherhand I have been mafia and used the same excuss before. "A mafia member wouldn't do that, so I must not be mafia!" Is not really a valid arguement as doing something very unmafia like is the best way for mafia to hide.

Vote: Mozric

[Zawicki]

We said ritha was acting mafia like. And look what he turned out to be.

Vote: Mozric

[Doohicky]

Holy crap guys! Calm down. There has been no discussion in this day phase. By all means declare your suspicions of Mozric, but hold off on the bandwagon. If Mozric is lynched really quickly and he turns out to be innocent we will have wasted a complete day phase.

I urge no one else to vote for Mozric YET. Have some discussion, see what else we have come up with and, if at the end you still think Mozric, then vote for him. Ending the day phase quickly is detrimental to us and only helps the Mafia.

[DeathForce]

How is it detrimental to us if we nail a mafioso?

Look what you guys managed to accomplish with all that debate you had. :roll:

Its time to sit down shut up and vote.

[scythes]

I still need to go over the last days posts a bit more, but from todays posts I'm leaning more toward Deathforce than Mozric. I was extremely suspicious of Moz before, and still am to a point, but I'm not really sure. He voted early and stuck to it, his long posts are typical of his play style, and he wasn't the only one who voted for Ritha yesterday. There were wuite a few people who were speaking out about lynching Ritha. A few of them actually admitted they didn't totally think Ritha was mafia, just that he wasn't adding anything to the discussion so why not kill him off, maybe get lucky and he'll be mafia. The day phase may have been cut down for length reasons, but it really didn't seem to last too long to me.

As for Deathforce, he seems really bloodthirsty right now.

Its time to sit down shut up and vote.
Kinda quick to just get all the votes out beings how it hasn't even been 24 hours since Sub began day 2, looks like someone liked the power they had in the night phase and wants to get back to it quickly. Also he was so sure Ritha had some type of role because the idea popped up and he just stuck with it. That turned out to be wrong and there was a lot of discussion about it, imagine how wrong this is and there's been no discussion today.

I'm looking at other people and still need to take a little while to look over yesterdays antics, and I mean looking at things besides the Mozric vs Ritha discussion. As always I have my suspicions, then there's everyone else, just because noone else is named Scythes!

[Baragash]

But I was right at least... he didn't have a special role.

It doesn't prove Ritha anything about a character role either way IMO, just proves he had no abilities, which we already knew.

As for Deathforce, he was on Ritha's side.

But Doohicky, now Doohicky wasn't on Ritha's side and he's appealing for calm when everyone is trying to lynch the prime suspect.......suspicious?

[Mozric]

But I was right at least... he didn't have a special role.

It doesn't prove Ritha anything about a character role either way IMO, just proves he had no abilities, which we already knew.

As for Deathforce, he was on Ritha's side.

But Doohicky, now Doohicky wasn't on Ritha's side and he's appealing for calm when everyone is trying to lynch the prime suspect.......suspicious?

I don't want to seem to be in a rush to defend Doohicky and condemn Deathforce... but, really, being on Ritha's side yesterday doesn't make a guarantee of innocence. The mafia would have known that Ritha was innocent, so they'd be happy to take his side.

I'm a bit suspicious of you now Baragash, since you seem so quick to defend Deathforce and try to throw suspicion on Doohicky.

[Grotfang]

Warning: Very long post (sorry!). Summary at the bottom.

Ok. So, our first lynch, I think it is fair to say, sucked. But, as I mentioned previously, I think the loss for the town was no so great. However, we do now have a few things we need to work out. Firstly, why did the mafia choose for Kilroy to be killed? Secondly, what was posted in the first day phase that could help us in determining who our potential mafia suspects are?

The first day phase was littered with unfortunate bandwagoning and wild accusations. It started with two highly tenuous suspicions that got blown very quickly out of proportion. The first was for Tarion (unfortunately, I think, initiated by myself) the second was for Deathforce (started by Mozric). Both of these hung on highly dubious assumptions and I do not believe there is a lot to them, so we can ignore the opinions themselves. However, what is of more interest is the proponents of each case and how the voting and accusations shifted over time.

The first recurring suspicion (beyond those mentioned above) was for Mozric, due to the way he seemed so dead set on the potential Deathforce/Aikanaro partnership. Unfortunately, this is where things get confusing because a parallel series of votes seemed to run against Deathforce at the same time because of his “acting defensively”. Now, this, to me, was unjustified, so I am going to do some quick analysis:


Wow jeez I love you two too, I can assure you I am quite innocent thank you.

To me, this doesn't seem defensive, but to Mozric and shotcoder it was unneccessarily strong:


I'm going to leave my vote on Deathforce. He seems quite defensive, more than is needed for having two votes on him that were clearly not very serious.


But even though DeathForce is the most Defensive

I can understand why Deathforce got frustrated! (Hence me calling them dubious assumptions in my second paragraph.) This means that, for me, Mozric appears to be fairly suspicious in retrospect, but we haven't yet got off the first page!

Moving on to other suspicions:

Aikanaro attracted suspicion early on because of a fairly throwaway comment:


I figured I would join the Bandwagon and go with one of the people that already has a vote.

Not a smart move, but it was retracted, and little more was said on the matter. Opinion then started to move towards Ritha, understandable given his posting. Mozric was one of the key proponents of this case, including Deathforce and Aikanaro in the plot. We know this is not the case, but I think his relentless suspicion of these two warrents analysis. As I have said, the case against Deathforce is purely because of a harmless comment that was responded to in a way he perceived (to his detriment) to be inflammatory. The case against Aikanaro is a throwaway line about bandwagoning because he didn't know who to vote for. The connection is simply that they voted for the same person in quick succession. Mozric then turned to exchanging Aikanaro for p3 in his plot; no real link here, simply that p3 hasn't said much and the two of them had each voted for each other.

As a final note against Mozric, he was the casting vote against Ritha. However, please don't see this as me presenting it as suspicious – the way I had left the voting presented a tie between himself and Ritha; it made perfect sense for him to push it in his favour, innocent or mafia. Any one of us would have done exactly the same thing.

This brings me to wonder... who could be innocent, who could be mafia and who have we no idea about? I have prepared a list to summarise my current thoughts:

Tarion'Maseth – potential innocent
Aikanaro – potential innocent
Mozric – potential mafia
shotcoder – potential innocent
Zawicki – potential innocent
scythes – potential innocent
DeathForce – potential innocent
Doohicky – potential mafia
Magnus777z – unknown
Baragash – potential innocent
Grotfang – potential mafia/unknown/potential innocent (delete as applicable :P)
p3990013 – potential mafia

Couple of points I haven't yet mentioned:

1)Magnus has only posted once since being reintroduced to the game and this was in this (brand new, shiny) day phase; voting for Mozric. I don't like seeing that lack of involvement and I would like to see more input from him.

2)p3990013 has not been hugely involved and has been hiding to some extent. Now, this is going to seem slightly weird, but it is based on Mozric's own analysis. Mozric jumped on Deathforce early on and has refused to let go of that suspicion. He started pairing Deathforce with Aikanaro but subtly shifted halfway through day one. Now, I think he believed the Deathforce suspicion would go further and in pairing Deathforce to p3, would remove suspicion from p3 when Deathforce was lynched. This is (in my opinion) a poor argument and it is not one I am happy to vote on at this stage, but it is a hunch I am going to keep my eye on for the time being. The problem is, going on my assumptions of innocence for various players, I have drawn myself into believing that the mafia must include some of the players who are posting less, thereby leading me to build on my existing assumptions.

3)Doohicky was one of the early voters for Aikanaro, adding weight to Mozric's suspicions. Again, I am presuming far too much and I apologise for this unfortunate lack of evidence in this latter part of the post, but I have to go somewhere with it and I prefer to have testable theories than indecision. Again, I do not intend to vote for Doohicky, but it is an addition to the theory I intend on keeping in the back of my head.

Summary:

1) Mozric has drawn suspicion and played on insecurities brought up from Deathforce and Aikanaro in order to try and guide the voting.
2) The Tarion and Deathforce votes that started within the first page of discussion were not based on logical arguments and therefore carry no weight.
3) There is a possibility that Mozric is trying to sneak fellow mafia players under the radar to avoid suspicion.
4) Magnus should post more.

Mozric is on four votes at the moment and, as much as I dislike bandwagoning as a tactic, I belive that in this particular line of voting, it is going in a pro-town direction.

Therefore:

Vote: Mozric

[Mozric]

Very clever grotfang. You do realise that now that the mafia can very easily push the vote for me to a lynch?

Fair enough if you want to vote for me, but can I ask if you (or somebody else with a vote on me) could UNVOTE for a period of at least 48 hours.

You're letting people like Aikanaro and p3990013 get away with going under the radar, which isn't in keeping with your "rational pro-town" analysis.


To me, this doesn't seem defensive, but to Mozric and shotcoder it was unneccessarily strong:

[quote]I'm going to leave my vote on Deathforce. He seems quite defensive, more than is needed for having two votes on him that were clearly not very serious.


But even though DeathForce is the most Defensive
[/quote:1m25yp3l]
Just to make it clear: I said the first quote and shotcoder said the second? Because I don't remember saying the second thing.

Damn, and grotfang, you looked like one of the good guys.

I guess I'd better make my list just in case the mafia see a good opportunity to strike for a lynch:

Tarion'Maseth – not sure... has been a bit dodgy and somewhat bloodthirsty today
Aikanaro – potential mafia, pretty suss for most of his posts
Mozric – potential awesomesauce
shotcoder – possibly innocent, a little dodgy
Zawicki – potential mafia, just seems manipulative to me.
scythes – potential innocent, seems pretty reasonable
DeathForce – possibly a defensive innocent, but could be a cunning mafia -- just because he's playing like he has in other games doesn't mean he's automatically innocent
Doohicky – probably innocent
Magnus777z – unknown
Baragash – potential innocent, but suddenly looking a bit more suspicious
Grotfang – like baragash, looked innocent but may not be
p3990013 – potential mafia -- lurking.

I still think Aikanaro looks guilty. You seem awful quick to dismiss the suspicions of him as "wild" and "irrational". Perhaps you're defending him grotfang?

Deathforce is my prime suspect #2. If he was mafia and therefore knew 100% that ritha was going to turn out innocent his actions yesterday make perfect sense.
Looks like my Deathforce/p/Ritha conspiracy has turned into a Deathforce/Aik/Grotfang conspiracy...

[Baragash]

But I was right at least... he didn't have a special role.

It doesn't prove Ritha anything about a character role either way IMO, just proves he had no abilities, which we already knew.

As for Deathforce, he was on Ritha's side.

But Doohicky, now Doohicky wasn't on Ritha's side and he's appealing for calm when everyone is trying to lynch the prime suspect.......suspicious?

I don't want to seem to be in a rush to defend Doohicky and condemn Deathforce... but, really, being on Ritha's side yesterday doesn't make a guarantee of innocence. The mafia would have known that Ritha was innocent, so they'd be happy to take his side.

Of course not, but I don't think I actually made any claims about DF's guilt or innocence, I just made an observation.


I'm a bit suspicious of you now Baragash, since you seem so quick to defend Deathforce and try to throw suspicion on Doohicky.

And in a game where the only means of figuring stuff out is through dialogue, I would be disappointed if you weren't. No one can prove their innocence unless they die. But define quick...?

Should I have waited a certain amount of time to offer an opinion in response to Scythes?
Is it somehow suspicious to simply be online?
Should I approach saying Doohicky's post was potentially suspicious from an oblique angle over several posts?

I know you're desperate here, but you can do better than that.

IMO looking at Deathforce at this juncture is not appropriate. It's akin to picking on Sub in a game for the way he picks people's posts apart. Abrasive and unfriendly? Yes. Reason for serious suspicion? Not heavily. For example, we have:
Doohicky potentially siding with you
Aik bandwagoning Ritha
Grotfang's dubious "he is of no use" logic (originally Tarion's IIRC), followed by a switch to the "other side" which could be a mafia tactic giving Moz up for dead
Tarion "he is of no use", although withdrawn
Scythes possibly trying to side-track DF on dubious grounds

IMO there are more worthy targets for investigating

[Baragash]

I give you points for subtlety by reinforcing it in the second post though.

[Grotfang]

Very clever grotfang. You do realise that now that the mafia can very easily push the vote for me to a lynch?

...

can I ask if you (or somebody else with a vote on me) could UNVOTE for a period of at least 48 hours.

Seems reasonable. I do agree that it would be fairer to have more discussion during this phase. I would still like to see responses from Magnus and some others.


Just to make it clear: I said the first quote and shotcoder said the second? Because I don't remember saying the second thing.


Yes. Should have made that clearer. I did try to include names, etc in the initial quotations, but I think I got my tags wrong and decided to save time. Sorry.

In conclusion, I will wait 48 hours and if anything new develops during that time, I will reconsider my voting. However, your guilt trip of "you looked like one of the good guys" isn't appreciated. I am laying my thoughts and opinions very clearly, not trying to persuade or drive to my own ends. I think my voting for you is obvious from the way I analysed the previous day phase. I am not voting on hunches or second guesses. Purely what looks most suspicious to me. Yes, this tactic is flawed as it means that I'm not picking up on quieter players and I apologise for that, but there are more quiet players than mafia, so if we start voting for them it's pretty hit and miss.

Therefore:

Unvote: Mozric

[scythes]

Scythes possibly trying to side-track DF on dubious grounds
Dubious grounds? You call Deathforce screaming for a lynch in less than 24 hours with next to no discussion dubious? You sir have just zoomed into my radar with all kinds of alarms flashing. The only reason I can imagine you saying this is dubious is because you are trying to protect a newer and slightly inexperienced player and fellow mafia. just incase anyone missed my last post, this is the DF quote I'm talking about...

Its time to sit down shut up and vote.
Also, I'm not sure what you're referring to when you said maybe you should have waited a little while before responding after my post, because as far as I remember this post is the first time I've even typed your name in this game. This is all extremely suspicious and leads me to believe there is a mafia link between Baragash and Deathforce.

VOTE: BARAGASH

[Baragash]

Scythes possibly trying to side-track DF on dubious grounds
Dubious grounds? You call Deathforce screaming for a lynch in less than 24 hours with next to no discussion dubious? You sir have just zoomed into my radar with all kinds of alarms flashing. The only reason I can imagine you saying this is dubious is because you are trying to protect a newer and slightly inexperienced player and fellow mafia. just incase anyone missed my last post, this is the DF quote I'm talking about...

So DF has made up his mind already and sees no need for discussion? If you take a look, you'll see plenty of others jump on Moz as soon as the new day started. I've already pointed out DF is abrasive, go and read Into the Belly of the Beast. It's his style.

And yes, I even said that calling DF on that is dubious grounds. In case we're not clear, I am saying that IMO DF's call for a lynch is not dubious.

I make no claims as to his guilt or innocence, simply that the grounds for considering him at present are not good enough.



Its time to sit down shut up and vote.
Also, I'm not sure what you're referring to when you said maybe you should have waited a little while before responding after my post, because as far as I remember this post is the first time I've even typed your name in this game. This is all extremely suspicious and leads me to believe there is a mafia link between Baragash and Deathforce.

Mozric accused me of being quick. I was asking him how in the blazes he managed to define my post as quick because I don't think him casting suspicion on me on the grounds he has is not even in the same galaxy as credible.

Chain of events:
Doohicky posts
DF posts
scythes posts
I post commenting on Doohicky and scythes' posts

Paraphrase 1: Doohicky makes post -> I say, interesting behaviour Doo, bit sus

Paraphrase 2: scythes makes point about DF -> I offer observation in possible counterpoint -> Moz applies subtext that I said "ZOMG DF is innocent, leave him alone" with no credible basis

That's now DF and myself you have targeted in what I feel, based on the suspicious behaviour I have highlighted in others, is an attempt to lead the town down the garden path.

Vote: scythes

[Zawicki]

Well, even if Mozric does end up being lynched (which doesn't seem as likely now) We might have a better chance at getting a mafia (if he isn't one) because, like mozric said we had put him into to lynching position for the mafia to come up and get him.

The recent post of scythes arises a lot of suspicion from me. He got very worked up over one post. He might of just misread some things though.

Right now Mozric is highest on my list, then doohicky, then Scythes.

[scythes]

Ok, I see how the reference from Baragash about responding so soon after my post, I didn't catch at that point that his little bit about DF was from me. But what I don't understand is how calling for a lynch on someone less than 24 hours into a day cannot be dubious. Looking back Magnus voted for Moz right away, but at least he gave some decent reasoning. Zawicki voted for him right away without much reasoning and I'm watching him, I just didn't post anything about it at the time. Sometimes it's good not to list all of you're suspicions so you can see how people react. Grotfang voted for Moz, but it seemed well thought out and he posted all of his reasoning, along with reasons to look at other people as well. Tarion voted for Moz on very shaky reasons, basically saying Ritha thought he was guilty, and since Ritha was innocent then whoever he tought was guilty must be. With no roles and no sure way to tell, there's no way Ritha could have known for sure who was guilty or not, but just because there was a huge battle on day 1 between Moz and Ritha, and Ritha turned out innocent, then obviously Moz "must" be guilty. This line of thinking is extremely flawed when noone knows who's innocent except mafias. Yes, I am still looking at Mozric, and if you look back I had my vote on him almost the entire first day except for a little bit when I switched to Ritha, but I switched right back to Mozric. If you believe everything the innocent Ritha said, I must be innocent as well, because he gave me a happy thumbs up. The thing is noone knows who's innocent or not, not even Ritha, but you all seem to believe Moz is guilty just because Ritha said so.

As for Deathforce, I know he's abrasive, but pratically screaming for a lynch only 10 hours after the day phase began is a bit beyond abrasive and leaning more towards a mistake made by a mafioso who is expected to act "abrasive." Not to mention, voting for Moz because...

lynching my mute buddy was a bad move dude!
has got to be the worst reasoning I have ever heard. It's like he's saying it was Moz who lynched Ritha all by himself.


IMO looking at Deathforce at this juncture is not appropriate. It's akin to picking on Sub in a game for the way he picks people's posts apart. Abrasive and unfriendly? Yes. Reason for serious suspicion? Not heavily.
This is why I voted for Baragash, I would vote for Bara and DF at the same time, but I only get one vote. Saying his previous post was no reason for serious suspicion looks a lot like you're trying to defend him because he made some mistake and you don't want him to get lynched and shown to be mafia. My vote is remaining on Baragash for now though I am still looking at DF, Moz, Zawicki, and Tarion.

[Magnus777z]

Leaving in 20 minutes to go camping for the weekend, I'll be back on monday I hope. Just a FYI.

[DeathForce]

Scythes for that wall of text you wrote I got, I'm voting for DF because his reasoning is dubious. you could have wrote that and saved me the extra minute it took to read your post.

I'll spell it out for you all since you all read into things way to much, or like to jump to conclusions.

Last day phase
1. Moz votes for me randomly
2. I call him a moron
3. Moz decides Ritha's odd posting is suspicious writes a bunch of bs to try and make his case
4. I defend Ritha
5. Moz and gang lynch Ritha

This day phase
1. I vote for Moz because he fked up
2. Am I pissed? Yes
3. Why? Because for all that debate you people did, you Lynched Ritha because he was playing differently from you. =D> =D> :stupid:

[shotcoder]

This day phase is extremely heated, but I look at DeathForce's reasoning and its true, Ritha was lynched not because he didn't contribute or because he didn't post, but because he played different than everyone else. I pulled my vote because he started helping out but people still insisted on bandwagoning him.

I'd like to make up for a lost innocent, so could we atleast attempt to not rush a lynch this day phase and get some discussion going? We really don't have any room for error now. As angry as I am at Moz right now, I don't see justification for his lynch, really no one sticks out as "extremely" suspicious, except maybe P3 and Magnus for their lack of input.

I feel really bad not leaving more info but I haven't read through all of the posts yet because they seem to all be the same exact thing being bickered back an forth and getting no where. I wouldn't be surprised if in these mini feuds if Mafia members dive in for the kill on a member.

[Subzero]

"The second day's first vote count will now begin. Remain silent and in your seats. Do not disobey these rules.

Mozric has four votes against himself - Tarion'Maseth, Deathforce, Magnus777z and Zawicki
Baragash has one vote for himself - scythes
scythes has one vote for himself - Baragash

Mozric is closest to being lynched with four votes of the necessary seven.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Aikanaro, Mozric, shotcoder, Doohicky, Grotfang and p3990013.

Your host would like me to warn you that future disobedience will be met with harsher punishments."

[Aikanaro]

Alright. It sucks that we lost an innocent, but at least now we can get on to finding the actual mafia members instead of having a debate over whether or not a mime is slowing us down. I still have a few suspicions toward who could be mafia. My current Suspicions are towards Mozric, Deathforce, and Grotfang. I don't want vote yet though ,because I don't want a lynch to occur so quick during only our second day together.

[Mozric]

Mozric accused me of being quick. I was asking him how in the blazes he managed to define my post as quick because I don't think him casting suspicion on me on the grounds he has is not even in the same galaxy as credible.
Okay, perhaps I should have said "keen" rather than "quick". It just seemed a bit strange that you felt the need to shut down Doohicky and try to move suspicion away from DF.


Sometimes it's good not to list all of you're suspicions so you can see how people react.
I agree with this bit. I was hesitant of posting my list of suspicions because I was waiting for somebody like Aik to act. But at that point I thought that I could be lynched before I got back.


Baragash and Grotfang are quite puzzling to me. In the first day they, along with scythes were the three I thought were pretty likely innocent. I'm not sure whether they're trying to be manipulative or they've just changed their argument style a little bit because of the game.

And it's true what scythes said... Ritha didn't know who was mafia. It's hard to say where the mafia were last day phase because there were two bandwagons: me and ritha. The mafia could have been trying to get either of us killed.

[scythes]

Yeah, sorry about that huge wall of text, I was prety much brainstorming but trying to make it slightly organized. I don't think it worked out well, next time I'll brainstorm on a sheet of paper or word or something and type it up a bit easier to read. I have a bad habit of doing that then rambling on for a while and getting lost in my thoughts. :mrgreen:

[DeathForce]

Feel free to use bullet points next time.

[Baragash]

Mozric accused me of being quick. I was asking him how in the blazes he managed to define my post as quick because I don't think him casting suspicion on me on the grounds he has is not even in the same galaxy as credible.
Okay, perhaps I should have said "keen" rather than "quick". It just seemed a bit strange that you felt the need to shut down Doohicky and try to move suspicion away from DF.

How am I "shutting down" Doohicky? He says something, I ask if it's suspicious - isn't that how this works?

And like I said, I believe there are presently much better suspects than DF. It doesn't matter what side you're on, you steer the conversation in line with whatever set of beliefs you hold at the time you post. Or have I misunderstood the game again?

You still haven't answere my question - how do I appear not keen or not quick?

After some thought, I'm going to return to my original Day 1 suspicion and

Unvote

Vote: Mozric

I will be watching you closely scythes.

[Grotfang]

Baragash and Grotfang are quite puzzling to me. In the first day they, along with scythes were the three I thought were pretty likely innocent. I'm not sure whether they're trying to be manipulative or they've just changed their argument style a little bit because of the game.

I don't think my style has changed much (beyond one instance of a longer than normal post). I have tried to only act on suspicions that I feel have good logic to them all along. Hence in the first phase I went for Ritha because of the cost/benefit analysis that I gave an overview of in my posts, in this phase I feel you are the only one who we have real evidence of being a potential mafia.

The only thing that's changed in my argument style is that I'm focussing it against you.

On a side note, one thing that's bothering me is that a lot of people are using this type of logic in their posts:

1) I think x might be mafia
2) y seems to be supporting/defending x
3) Therefore y must be mafia
4) Vote y

Surely voting x would make more sense people! If you use the premise that x is mafia in order to conclude that y is, then there are two places that you could be going wrong. Voting for x reduces it to one.

[scythes]

Got kinda slow today, anyway, just making myself known yet again that my vote remains on Baragash and I see Deathforce as extremely suspicious. Would like to see a few more people post though.

[Mozric]

I don't really know what else to say in my defence. It's really up to the other players now to decide.

I'd like to ask though: who thinks that I am NOT the most suspicious player? Because I'm not sure whether people are voting for me because it's a cool bandwagon or for vengeance for ritha and I'm not sure what the people who aren't voting think.

I've laid out my suspicions previously and there isn't much significant to add. One main thing though, is that I think that people are making a mistake with Deathforce. Most people seem to think "oh yeah, he is suspicious, but he's Deathforce and he has an abrasive play style so we'll let him get away with it". That's just wrong. That'd be like saying that I can't be mafia because I'm doing long posts like in my other games. You've got to go with what you think is suspicious, and Deathforce seems very keen for a lynch.


I'm not even going to respond to Baragash's continual picking of what exactly I meant by "quick" or "keen". I think what I meant by that was fairly obvious (somebody else can explain it to him if they care to), so Baragash is either reading way too much into that word or is wilfully missing the point.

[Baragash]

I'm not even going to respond to Baragash's continual picking of what exactly I meant by "quick" or "keen". I think what I meant by that was fairly obvious (somebody else can explain it to him if they care to), so Baragash is either reading way too much into that word or is wilfully missing the point.

Topic avoidance much?

I apologise if I've missed an explanation somewhere, but all I can see is a change of word.

Non-keen/quick play: I am online, I see Doohicky and scythes make posts, I respond. This is normal, no? It isn't like I went, "ZOMG, Doohicky is clearly Mafia, Lynch, LYNCH, LYNCH him now!" I threw an idea out.

If we take what I did as an example of being quick/keen, well, everyone is clearly Mafia, and we may as well go and lynch ourselves.

Keen/quick play: thanks to scythes, we need look no further than an example of being quick/keen.

I understand what is meant by quick/keen play, I do not understand how what I did was such.

[DeathForce]

Baragash is clearly mafia for using the word mafia twice in his post!

[Tarion'Maseth]

Baragash is clearly mafia for using the word mafia twice in his post!
Deathforce is clearly Mafia, he voted for someone

:O



Non-keen/quick play: I am online, I see Doohicky and scythes make posts, I respond. This is normal, no? It isn't like I went, "ZOMG, Doohicky is clearly Mafia, Lynch, LYNCH, LYNCH him now!" I threw an idea out.As far as I can tell, that *is* what Mozric's accusing you of. Not of being quick to the topic, but rather of rushing through the Day phase... I think.

[DeathForce]

Tarion has discovered my identity quickly vote him off! :smt005

[scythes]

Yeah, I think the whole joking part has been dragged out a bit too far.


Non-keen/quick play: I am online, I see Doohicky and scythes make posts, I respond. This is normal, no? It isn't like I went, "ZOMG, Doohicky is clearly Mafia, Lynch, LYNCH, LYNCH him now!" I threw an idea out.

This is actually exactly what DF did to Mozric, and for no other reason than Mozric voted for Ritha and Ritha was innocent. I do agree it's possible Baragash isn't guilty because, in my opinion, he's been defending DF, thus...

UNVOTE: BARAGASH

VOTE: DEATHFORCE

This does not mean I don't think Baragash is still guilty, but DF looks a lot more suspicious to me than anyone else. I am still eyeing Mozric and Baragash and a couple others I'll keep to myself at this time though, some of which I'm keeping an eye on just because their names aren't Scythes!

[DeathForce]

Yeah, I think the whole joking part has been dragged out a bit too far.


Non-keen/quick play: I am online, I see Doohicky and scythes make posts, I respond. This is normal, no? It isn't like I went, "ZOMG, Doohicky is clearly Mafia, Lynch, LYNCH, LYNCH him now!" I threw an idea out.

This is actually exactly what DF did to Mozric, and for no other reason than Mozric voted for Ritha and Ritha was innocent. I do agree it's possible Baragash isn't guilty because, in my opinion, he's been defending DF, thus...

UNVOTE: BARAGASH

VOTE: DEATHFORCE

This does not mean I don't think Baragash is still guilty, but DF looks a lot more suspicious to me than anyone else. I am still eyeing Mozric and Baragash and a couple others I'll keep to myself at this time though, some of which I'm keeping an eye on just because their names aren't Scythes!

:stupid:

[scythes]

That's quite a defense for yourself you have there DF. I wish everyone would believe I was innocent by only posting smileys. Maybe this will help... :mrgreen:

[DeathForce]

There is no point debating everything is just random speculation, why should I waste my time. :smt015

[scythes]

Because by not posting your thought you are effectively lurking and not adding anything to the discussion. There is no way for anyone to learn anything from you, good or bad, from a post with just a smiley. And, as often mentioned, lurking is a favorite scheme of the mafia. Thus, another reason for my vote. :smt016

[DeathForce]

Right because I would be that stupid. :roll:

Like I keep saying since there is no way to confirm anyones guilt or innocence, all this is just random stabbing in the dark. Next you are going to say I am mafia because I used the term stabbing. :-s

[Tarion'Maseth]

Right because I would be that stupid. :roll:

Like I keep saying since there is no way to confirm anyones guilt or innocence, all this is just random stabbing in the dark. Next you are going to say I am mafia because I used the term stabbing. :-sDeathforce, that's just not true. There's no way to -confirm- guilt or innocence, but to say it's just a random stab is just stupid. We can look at votes, we can look at arguments. You're saying we should just be picking names out of a hat in order to determine who to vote for? Sounds like the argumentation of the Mafia to me. Being Mafia is the only reason I can think of to say that we can't tell who's innocent and who's not. It seems like a deliberate move to sow misdirection and uncertainty in the town.

[DeathForce]

If I could reach through the computer and slap you I would, you all sure like to jump to conclusions and pulling something out of nothing. I say we just vote everyone who voted for ritha off that way we should get at least one or 2 mafia

[scythes]

You do reaslise that right now there are 13 players, 3 of which are mafia. You only need 7 votes for a lynch so if 4 townies vote for someone all three mafia could vote and lynch someone. During the night phase another townie would die putting us at 1 players, 3 of which are mafia, and only 6 needed for a lynch. Then only 3 townies need to vote for the mafia to jump in and lynch. Every time we just pick a random person to lynch and it turns out to be innocent, the mafia get that one step closer to winning. This is the reason for discussion, to see what people think, how people present their opinions, who votes for who, when they vote, and a lot of other factors. Just like Tarion said, by wanting so bad to just randomly lynch someone, just because they voted for an innocent, with no thought for discussion, sows the seeds of confusion and is a sure mafia tactic. :smt016

[DeathForce]

I think you must be mafia for second guessing me. :lol:

[Grotfang]

There is no point debating everything is just random speculation, why should I waste my time. :smt015

Deathforce, this is ridiculous. You signed up to play the game. Yes, it's speculation - that is the nature of the game and you knew what you were signing up for when you made that first post in the topic ("I'm in", etc). If your attitude really is "why should I waste my time", then you should quit.

The reason we post is so that as a group we can play off one another to try and base our suspicions on something concrete. If you don't post, there's no value to playing. The point of the game is not to win or lose - there are no prizes either way - it is to play.

That post of yours pissed me off. I don't like seeing players actively not contributing anything worthwhile. That's worse than simply lurking IMO.

[Subzero]

"The day's second vote count will now begin. Please remain silent and in your seats.

Mozric has five votes against himself - Tarion'Maseth, Deathforce, Magnus777z, Zawicki and Baragash
DeathForce has one vote for himself - scythes

Mozric is closest to being lynched with five votes of the necessary seven.

The following players are not actively voting at this stage: Aikanaro, Mozric, shotcoder, Doohicky, Grotfang and p3990013.

Your benevolent host hopes that future discussion will be as productive and entertaining as recent debate has."

[DeathForce]

There is no point debating everything is just random speculation, why should I waste my time. :smt015

Deathforce, this is ridiculous. You signed up to play the game. Yes, it's speculation - that is the nature of the game and you knew what you were signing up for when you made that first post in the topic ("I'm in", etc). If your attitude really is "why should I waste my time", then you should quit.

The reason we post is so that as a group we can play off one another to try and base our suspicions on something concrete. If you don't post, there's no value to playing. The point of the game is not to win or lose - there are no prizes either way - it is to play.

That post of yours pissed me off. I don't like seeing players actively not contributing anything worthwhile. That's worse than simply lurking IMO.

And your post made me :smt005

The only way to get something "concrete" is for someone to go, "Hey I am mafia please lynch me"

People lurking, acting shady, being ass's doesn't mean fuck all. Just because I am innocent doesn't mean I can't get my kicks antagonizing the rest of you. :twisted:

[Tarion'Maseth]

There is no point debating everything is just random speculation, why should I waste my time. :smt015

Deathforce, this is ridiculous. You signed up to play the game. Yes, it's speculation - that is the nature of the game and you knew what you were signing up for when you made that first post in the topic ("I'm in", etc). If your attitude really is "why should I waste my time", then you should quit.

The reason we post is so that as a group we can play off one another to try and base our suspicions on something concrete. If you don't post, there's no value to playing. The point of the game is not to win or lose - there are no prizes either way - it is to play.

That post of yours pissed me off. I don't like seeing players actively not contributing anything worthwhile. That's worse than simply lurking IMO.

And your post made me :smt005

The only way to get something "concrete" is for someone to go, "Hey I am mafia please lynch me"

People lurking, acting shady, being ass's doesn't mean f*** all. Just because I am innocent doesn't mean I can't get my kicks antagonizing the rest of you. :twisted:
OK, and with that Unvote.

Vote: Deathforce.

You admit to antagonising everyone else. There's no good reason to do this if you're pro-town. Either, you deliberately want us to fail (Mafia, or just being a pain in the arse) or you don't care. Neither helps.

[Grotfang]

And your post made me :smt005

The only way to get something "concrete" is for someone to go, "Hey I am mafia please lynch me"

People lurking, acting shady, being ass's doesn't mean f*** all. Just because I am innocent doesn't mean I can't get my kicks antagonizing the rest of you. :twisted:

Kinda missed the point, didn't you?

I never said it equated to being mafia. Just that it ruins the game. And by concrete all I meant is that we need actual posts to be made to make this a game as opposed to a raffle.

[scythes]

Raffle = bad, this is supposed to be a game of skill, not just some random thing where you hope you picked right. Otherwise each day phase would only last a day.

[DeathForce]

Tarion you are very wrong there are very good reasons to antagonize people, it makes them emotional and what happens when people get emotional?

emotional people let things slip they normally would not.

I will call this the Ritha Syndrome, since I don't like to play the way you all do. I am somehow bad or not helpful, which is not true what so ever.

For example you an Scythes seem like two mafioso's trying to get me band wagoned. Dun Dun Dun guess who else's names were on the list when Ritha was lynched, oh right that would be you two. :-k

[scythes]

Actually my vote was on Mozric when Ritha was lynched. I did switch to Ritha at one point, but switched back because I thought he was acting suspiciously but not enough to warrant my vote. Turn peoples eyes from you much? :eek:

[DeathForce]

Well sorry I just was looking at the vote counts and both tarion and your name was on Ritha's so you are bad guys clearly.

[shotcoder]

This is exactly why I voted for DF in the first day phase. Not only did he blatantly attack Moz for calling him defensive but he defended himself stupidly. Now it happening again.....DF is being prosecuted and he starts getting pissy with people who vote for him.

My grudge from day 1 stands

Vote: DeathForce

[Mozric]

As I said before, I don't think Deathforce should be given the benefit of the doubt. He badly wanted a lynch in the first few hours of the day phase, and his comments to the effect of anyone who voted for ritha is probably mafia seems to be trying to handwave off the suspicion that has fallen on him.

If Deathforce were mafia he would have been happy to let the battle between myself and Ritha play out. Since Ritha got lynched yesterday (and not me) it looks like an innocent emotional reaction, trying to get me lynched today. If I got lynched earlier today, who would blame Deathforce? I'm glad that grotfang was willing to take his vote off me for a day or so, because otherwise Deathforce would have fallen right under the radar.

Anyway, I'm suspicious enough of Deathforce to:

Vote: Deathforce

I have a few other suspects, but right now he's looking like the best person to put a vote on.

[Doohicky]

Sorry folks, was away for a long weekend there.

I haven't read over the last few days yet, but until then I will put my vote to Aikanaro as I still think he hasn't explained his want for the bandwagon in the first dayphase (as far as I can see).

After reading through all the weekend posts this vote is likely to change, but wanted to have something on the board. Will post more later with a full update.

[DeathForce]

Anyone else want to jump on the dumb ass express, its going nonstop to failville.

[Tarion'Maseth]

Anyone else want to jump on the dumb ass express, its going nonstop to failville.
And this is why I'm maintaining my vote on you. In Mafia, you defend yourself. You don't just attack the people targeting you. As to "not playing the way I play", you're not playing at all. You're not contributing, and admit to antagonising people. We have no reason to believe you're not mafia, you're not justifying anything you do. When you do justify it, it's as simple as "You voted for Ritha, Ritha was innocent." But 5 people voted for Ritha. There are 3 Mafia.

[DeathForce]

Why bother defending myself you clearly have made up your mind.

[Aikanaro]

Wow, deathforce buddy you really have dug yourself a good way to China. I don't see why you feel the need to bash the other players for how they play, but saying that the game is just a random stabbing in the dark to me sounds like you don't care whatsoever about the outcome of the game.

I was originally going to vote for Mozric because of his shady behavior but after reading your past few votes I'm going to have to say that you must either be a really arrogant mafia or someone who just doesn't give a damn. Either way I don't like the way you post and feel that it isn't needed here.

Vote: DeathForce

[Magnus777z]

Vote: Deathforce
For simply being against the game itself, WTF man.
Your basically Trolling, at this point I dont think anyone cares if your mafia or not.
I don't see you just basically acting like a dick helping.

[Grotfang]

Can I just point out to everyone that p3 has not said anything during this day phase, despite having been online posting at times.

I made a point previously about a possible Mozric/p3 partnership and I am still watching that. One thing that I have noticed over this whole Deathforce business is that some players have been fighting pretty fiercely to drive the point home, while others have sat back to let it tire itself out. Now, which one happens is irrelevant. I chose to sit back because I do not belive Deathforce is a mafia. He is however, being a pain in the arse and doing his utmost to piss people off. I have no sympathy for him if he is voted off. As I said previously, it is a game to enjoy as a group... the winning or losing isn't the main objective!

Back to the point. Mozric still seems suspicious to me, but p3's decision not to post this phase is bugging me. It has however struck me that p3 is the only overlap Mozzie and I had on our list of suspects. I'm not sure if that should make a difference to my thinking (given my earlier objection to a x --> x/y --> y logic), but I'm still trying to figure out how to approach it.

I said before that I would put my vote back on Mozric if I didn't feel I had been persuaded otherwise, and I'm afraid my suspicions of him remain (although they have been slightly confounded).

Therefore:

Vote: Mozric

Also, Deathforce is currently on 6 votes (I think).

[p3990013]

vote: p3990013

>>

<<

[Grotfang]

vote: p3990013

>>

<<

Are you saying you're mafia?

[p3990013]

vote: p3990013

>>

<<

Are you saying you're mafia?

I'm saying I don't have a clue. So I'll vote me.

[DeathForce]

Damn P3 and people thought I was shady :/

[DeathForce]

I would also like to say that my posts yesterday were when I was going on about 36 hours of no sleep so I was just trying to make you all as miserable as I was. :smt009

[Subzero]

"The day's third vote count will now begin. Please remain silent and in your seats.

Mozric has four votes against himself - Deathforce, Zawicki, Baragash and Grotfang
DeathForce has six votes for himself - scythes, Tarion'Maseth, shotcoder, Mozric, Aikanaro and Magnus777z
Aikanaro has one vote for himself - Doohicky
p3990013 has one vote for himself - p3990013

DeathForce is closest to being lynched with six votes of the necessary seven.

All players are voting at this stage.

Your host is pleased with this level of total activity and enthusiasm."

[Tarion'Maseth]

Er... P posted on this very page.

[DeathForce]

our host seriously has to learn to pay attention if hes so in control of us all.

[Subzero]

Er... P posted on this very page.
Curse you p3990013!

Cuuuurse youuuuuu!

EDIT: I noticed that p3990013 voted for himself and, after checking back through recent pages I discovered that Doohicky voted for Aikanaro. The problem with both of these votes was that they weren't in the correct format. Although I was able to find them it wasn't easy and I might have missed one or both of them. That may have had a significant effect on the game, so please remember to vote using the normal format.