New Warhammer 40k ruleset?

[Baragash]

Only if they want to encourage Mech even more.

[Gendoikari87]

15 out of 15 Lootas in a Battlewagon agree.

yeah there would be an OP use of that rule or two. overall I don't think it would be OP though outside of 15 lootas, maybe restrict Heavy weapons from firing out of non open topped vehicles?

[Gendoikari87]

Only if they want to encourage Mech even more.

My name is gendo and I support this move. But then again i'm a horribly biased mechhead.

[SourImplant]

yeah there would be an OP use of that rule or two. overall I don't think it would be OP though outside of 15 lootas, maybe restrict Heavy weapons from firing out of non open topped vehicles?

Sternguard or full plasma Command Squad in a Rhino?

[BrokenWing]

On the percentage system: I find it far less restrictive than the current 40k force chart. I play Fantasy, a lot. If you converted it straight over, it would look like this: up to 25% hq, 25%+ troops, up to 25% fast attack, up to 50% elite, up to 25% heavy support. That gives you 500 points max in several areas. I haven't met many armies that spend upwards of 500 points on anything but maybe heavy support. What would likely happen is the game would go from 2,000 points to 2,500, just like Fantasy standard went from 2,000 to 2,500 or 3,000.

[SourImplant]

I haven't met many armies that spend upwards of 500 points on anything but maybe heavy support.

Nob Bikers?

Death Company?

[BrokenWing]

Death Company are troops, in a 2000 point game you can spend up to about 90% on troops (taking out 10% for an obligatory hq choice) that really shouldn't be a problem? Nob Bikers are fast? or elite? If they're fast you might have a little trouble, but if they're elite, you can spend 1,000 points on Elite so...

[SourImplant]

They're Elite unless you have a Warboss leading the army, then they can be taken as Troops.

[BrokenWing]

So then it's not really a problem for Orks either. Remember it would be 0-50% on elites and troops of course are minimum 25% with no maximum.

[Gendoikari87]

Sternguard or full plasma Command Squad in a Rhino?

then they only get to fire two weapons. Besides sternguard can already fire can't they? that's the point of fire points isn't?

[SourImplant]

Besides sternguard can already fire can't they? that's the point of fire points isn't?

Yes and no. Their weapons are Rapid Fire. Makes a difference in games under 5th Edition rules, and a bigger difference if Rapid Fire is changed in 6th Edition.

[Gendoikari87]

still, it's only two weapons from a rhino, and it makes transports really useful.

[PyroSikTh]

On the percentage system: I find it far less restrictive than the current 40k force chart. I play Fantasy, a lot. If you converted it straight over, it would look like this: up to 25% hq, 25%+ troops, up to 25% fast attack, up to 50% elite, up to 25% heavy support. That gives you 500 points max in several areas. I haven't met many armies that spend upwards of 500 points on anything but maybe heavy support. What would likely happen is the game would go from 2,000 points to 2,500, just like Fantasy standard went from 2,000 to 2,500 or 3,000.

I have a problem with two things you pointed out - each section is restricted by points. This is what I disagree with, and it forces certain builds. If I want to field 3 Land Raiders in 2,000pts, I damn well want to field 3 Land Raiders. If I want Zahndrekh, Obyron, an Overlord, and a Royal Court for each, I damn well want Zahndrekh, Obyron, an Overlord, and a Royal Court for each. Under the percentage system, I don't have the option of either of these, as they rack up way too many points. You don't see things like this typically BECAUSE they cost so many points, but making it from a choice to a restriction is not something I want to be playing.

The other point is 2,500pt games. They are far too large. I prefer 1,500pts because, for me they're just the right length. I find 2,000pt games can drag on, and you just can't fit everything in 1,000pt games.

[Gendoikari87]

actually percentages gets less restrictive cause you can make 4 land raider lists at 2000 points.

[PyroSikTh]

actually percentages gets less restrictive cause you can make 4 land raider lists at 2000 points.

How do you figure that? If you're counting Dedicated Transport ones, then you can actually get 6 right now. Under the percentages rules, that suddenly drops to 4 (2 HS Land Raiders makes circa 500pts, which is your 25% allowance, +2 Dedicated Transport Land Raiders for Elites which makes 500pts, and then the units they transport are circa another 300-500pts, which is your 50% allowance). Of course neither of these consider the HQ and Troops you'd also have in your army.

Bottom line, if I wanted 40k to start turning into Fantasy, I'd just play Fantasy.

[SourImplant]

actually percentages gets less restrictive cause you can make 4 land raider lists at 2000 points.

Wouldn't that make your Heavy Support percentage around, say, 100%?

EDIT: I fail at maths. And no, I'm not correcting it.

[Gendoikari87]

250 x 4 = 1000 1000/2000 = 50%

EDIT: I fail at maths. And no, I'm not correcting it.

It's okay, we can't all be mathematicians.

but yeah and the minimum troops for 2000 would be like two space marine squads, for 1000 points you'd only need 1 squad. HQ's would get fucked up though in some codexes, cause if they do it like fantasy, at max 50% (in 40k lords and heroes are combined) you'd be able to have some nasty shit going on in say. Grey knights. Like 8 models between HQ and elite with OSR's.

[Gendoikari87]

Some other "fun" stuff that would come out of percentages

18 Plasma cannon armored sentinel guard armies
6 Manticore guard armies
6 Deathstrike Guard armies (okay lol that would get OP.)

Course some of those get nerfed if they institute the no duplicates or limited duplicates of fantasy.

[Gendoikari87]

which is your 25% allowance

huh, there would be no 25% allowance it would be 50%

HQ 50%
Elite 50%
Troops min 25%
Fast Attack 50%
Heavy support 50%
..... Forgeworld/new rare category 25%

[SourImplant]

2,000 point game, 50% is Troops?

250 Gretchin, 25 Runtherds.

And 1,000 points left over.

Someone check my maths.