1,000pts

[PyroSikTh]

Tweaking this and taking some risks to try and make it a bit more workable at lower point levels;

HQ
Overlord - Warscythe, Resurrection Orb - 130pts
Overlord - Warscythe, Resurrection Orb - 130pts

Elites
6 Lychguard - Hyperphase Sword and Dispersion Shield - 240pts

Troops
7 Immortals - Tesla - 119pts (Overlord)
7 Immortals - Tesla - 119pts (Overlord)

Fast Attack
5 Scarabs - 75pts

Heavy Support
Annihilation Barge - 90pts
Annihilation Barge - 90pts

Total - 993pts

Not quite sure about this list. There's no Gauss so my anti-vehicle has shot right down, however I have 2 Warscythes, 5 Scarabs and 2 Annihilation Barges. I've got the anti-infantry in all the Tesla, and the close combat support from the Lychguard and Overlords. I only have 2 units of Troops, but they're pretty tough with the Res Orb Overlords.

C&C?

[edmundblack]

I think it's too much HQ. Whilst getting those Immortals a nice 4+ RA is great, it leaves them a little low on models. Even with Tesla, a lot of armies will be able to lay down more firepower than they can, and eventually that weight of fire will show.

In terms of anti-vehicle, 5 Scarabs are likely to kill what? One vehicle perhaps, two if they're badly placed? And without Gauss around in sufficient numbers, I reckon you'd struggle.

You've a good CC rock there, but it's not going places fast. As such, it'd likely get outmaneouvered and gunned down quite quickly. If they stay out of harms way and act as a "f*ck off unit" protecting the home objective, that's a lot of points not doing very much.

I actually quite like the list, but I don't think it has enough punch to counter-act much thrown at it by the opponent.

[PyroSikTh]

To be honest, I'd rather have the 4+ RA over the 1 and a bit extra Immortals the cost of the Res Orb would buy me.

Lack of anti-vehicle is a problem, but as I pointed out, there are Warscythes and Annihilation Barges, and pretty much everything else is S5.

On the Lychguard, that's exactly what they're there for. Staying back with my Immortals and keeping them safe from being wiped in combat. They're not going anywhere fast, but neither is anything else in the army.

[Arlins]

would it be worth dropping the scarabs and adding a cyptek with eldritch lance and solarpulse , it would give a little anti tank at long distance and the solar pulse a little bit more 1st rnd
survivabilty

[edmundblack]

But str5 Vs AV11 isn't assured, trust me. 6 is nice, but even that is no guarantee. And 5 scarabs, as I said, are unlikely to do much beyond take down one vehicle. And Warscythes are only good if they've got to where you want them to be.

[sneggy]

You intend to sit back and bunker? All your firepower is short ranged. I just cant see this working. Drop to 1 overlord.
Run him with a squad of immortals and get a unit of warriors+ghost ark for survivability in there.
Adds mobility, a little gauss and removes the need for a second res orb by introducing ghost ark instead.
Also bring in more AV13 for wall building.

[PyroSikTh]

Really haven't been impressed with Warriors and Ghost Arks, particularly against EB's bikes. Not that I'm list tailoring, just that he's my major opponent and I don't want to be wasting my points and time. Besides, Immortals are cooler in just about every way.

Also, I'm not intending to really bunker down, I'm just saying that the Lychguard will escort the Immortals, whether they bunker down or not. If the opponent doesn't come to me, I haven't really got any choice but to go to them, and 24" is plenty.

I like the idea of a Harbringer of Destruction with Solar Pulse, but Scarabs will kill a tough vehicle dead. I'm not sure one Cryptek for the same amount of points is quite as reliable, even though it's more survivable.

EDIT: If I drop one Overlord and give the remaining Overlord a Phase Shifter to run with the Lychguard, cut the Lychguard down to 5 and drop the Scarabs, I get this;

HQ
Overlord - Warscythe, Resurrection Orb, Phase Shifter - 175pts

Elites
5 Lychguard - Hyperphase Swords and Dispersion Shields - 225pts

Troops
7 Immortals - Tesla - 119pts
7 Immortals - Tesla - 119pts

Heavy Support
Annihilation Barge - 90pts
Annihilation Barge - 90pts

That gives me 182pts to spend. Suggestions?

[sneggy]

Cheesy as hell but 3 squads of scarabs....

[PyroSikTh]

3 squads of 4 is a beautiful idea, but I'm 4 Scarab bases short

[edmundblack]

It's not beautiful at all, in any way whatsoever. Vs bikes it means jack, but against anything it's damn-near tailoring. But worst of all, it's boring/ unimaginative, and you're better than that Pyro.

More Immortals immediately springs to mind. More Troops is never a bad idea in my view.

[PyroSikTh]

It's not beautiful at all, in any way whatsoever. Vs bikes it means jack, but against anything it's damn-near tailoring. But worst of all, it's boring/ unimaginative, and you're better than that Pyro.

I'm going to be honest, I'm actually starting to get sick of your judgement of my armies. Everything I field against you you seem to find some complaint, and labour on about how cheesy I'm being, just because I field the models I like and enjoy using. You know I'm not interested in being cheesy, and you know I just don't list-tailor. I told you on Monday how much I love swarms, and how gleeful I am that Scarabs are actually useful. Sure they mean jack against your bikes, so why aren't you celebrating, and encouraging me to do it? If I'm being boring and unimaginative by fielding the models I want to field, then I'm boring and unimaginative!

[edmundblack]

Aww, c'mon - pinch of salt required. Swarms are good, I can't deny that. The very thought of finding 30 on the other of the board is ... intriguing to say the least, or even 15. 5 is certainly too low to get far, as if all else fails - shoot at them instead. The thought that they'll just rock up, look at a model vastly more expensive in points than them and destroy it without trying is exasperating to say the least, but it's not your fault. It's a lot to get through, but not impossible. It's not your fault that they've been made into the uber-good auto include that they are. There are many of those in the game right now, some are better than others and very often they have their own reputation associated with them. They're like Flicker Fields, Pysbolts and such - why wouldn't you take them? Personally, with scarabs I think there's other things which those points could be spent on and still be left with a good list.

It's your army, take whatever you like (not meant in a sneery way). It's just that perhaps there's other things just as viable to take instead, they're not the only choice there. Destroyers perhaps? Alas, they're taking their time on the second wave. That'd help a lot no doubt - Stalkers much?

[PyroSikTh]

But I like Scarabs. I'd probably take Scarabs even if they weren't quite as good. I've never liked Destroyers, which is why I waited for the Necron update, so I wouldn't be forced to fielding masses of them just to stand a chance.

I can apply pinches of salt, but it's getting harder and harder by the week the more you go on about those kind of things. It really does get me down.

[edmundblack]

They're cute, true. Which is an odd thing to say for a pocket calculator on legs.

I can apply pinches of salt, but it's getting harder and harder by the week the more you go on about those kind of things. It really does get me down.

All I can say is: I'm sorry. Really really sorry. It's not typical of me to be honest, so I don't know where it's coming from. I'm generally far more light-hearted than this. It's only a damn game after all.

How about:

HQ
Overlord - Warscythe, Resurrection Orb, Phase Shifter - 175pts

Troops
10 Immortals, Tesla, Lord, Res Orb, Warscythe: 245
10 Immortals, Tesla, Lord, Res Orb, Warscythe: 245

Heavy Support
Annihilation Barge - 90pts
Annihilation Barge - 90pts

Gives you 845. 155 for other stuff, you've got some solid Troops + Lord in there which can pack a punch and lots of space to get some extras in. Or 10 Scarabs with 5 points left over (honestly, take them if you want, nothing to do with me).

[PyroSikTh]

All I can say is: I'm sorry. Really really sorry. It's not typical of me to be honest, so I don't know where it's coming from. I'm generally far more light-hearted than this. It's only a damn game after all.

It is, but it's a fairly big part of all our lives too, otherwise we wouldn't be wasting our time on this forum talking about it You just get a bit passionate about it, like we all do.

[edmundblack]

Chest-bump? Rawr. I f*****g love you man! *bawl* Done now? Excellent. (I guess we all do, in our own way. Guess I've just got really pissed off with the cheese-mongers ruining my GKs (looking at you BOLS ... ) and getting lumped in by association due to my army choice).

List posted above - any good?

[commandojimbob]

I like EBs list above - a very solid core for sure ! I also like your list pyro on post 7 - and both lists have similar points left over. I would say EB's suggestion is the more resilient due to the Lords and Res Orbs but at 1000pts - Lychguard will mean you will be able to deal with any elite units someone else brings.

Skimming down the posts, EB, I cant believe you knocked the scarabs suggestion - I would recommend taking 2 units of 5 for sure - they are Beautiful indeed. They are not quite auto-include (not far off) but looking at both lists, they need another means of taking down mech or bogging down infantry - seriously - scarabs are really that good at taking mech out.

[PyroSikTh]

Okay, here's another alternative I'm playing about with;

HQ
Overlord - Warscythe, Phaeron, Resurrection Orb, Phase Shifter - 195pts

Troops
20 Warriors - Ghost Ark - 375pts (Overlord)
5 Immortals - 85pts
5 Immortals - 85pts

Fast Attack
5 Scarabs - 75pts

Heavy Support
Annihilation Barge - 90pts
Annihilation Barge - 90pts

Total - 995pts

Haven't got quite the close-combat presence I feel I need, but I do have plenty of Gauss this time, and my close combat ability is in support of the big blob. The bonus to this list is also that everything can sit back at 24" rather than having to close in for those extra shots.

The cheeky bonus of this list is that I don't need to buy anything to use it. Downside is I don't like Warriors...

[edmundblack]

Warriors aren't that bad, but they're no Immortals. 20 is enough to bring anyone up and think, especially with Relentless. You need the Gauss to stun-lock vehicles, and 20 will ensure a solid area is held.

CC will always be your weakness, even when you do have Lychguard or whatever in there. But if you use your guns well, that shouldn't prove too much of an issue for you.

Would it be possible to instead have Immortals with Gauss alongside the Telas Immortals? Best of both then.

[PyroSikTh]

From a list perspective, certainly, but not from a modelling/financial perspective.